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>religious beliefs that "everything must be done" to save a life no matter how much pain or suffering is causes. It's morally distressing. A life full of pain

>religious beliefs that "everything must be done" to save a life no matter how much pain or suffering is causes. It's morally distressing. A life full of pain and suffering is still a life. The alternative you're offering is not something without paid and suffering, it's worse. Notexisting is worse than pain and suffering.

jamesredman 4y ago
Except that death is fact of life, pain and suffering are not.
ako 4y ago
For some, the pain and suffering is so bad that notexisting is actually better.
bwhaley 4y ago
> Notexisting is worse than pain and suffering. That’s a stretch. Far more important to come to terms with mortality than extend life indefinitely. Is it even still living to have a heartbeat but with motor control, limited or no ability to speak, and no memory? Is “living” in this way best for the next of kin? I found a recent episode of the Making Sense podcast in this topic to be thought provoking. You might give it a listen. https://www.samharris.org/podcasts/making-sense-episodes/297-preparing-for-the-end https://www.samharris.org/podcasts/making-sense-episodes/297...
Pwhy1 4y ago
I completely disagree. I would rather not exist than be in truly agonising pain for the rest of my existence. Heck, I've had something as simple as bad food poisoning where, if it was a terminal symptom, I would have ended it.
secondcoming 4y ago
You didn't exist until you were conceived. That wasn't so bad, was it?
_qua 4y ago
A case I recall particularly vividly was a man in his late 90s who had end stage dementia to the point that he couldn’t interact with his environment or even speak. His limbs were contracted and he was permanently in a kind of fetal position. He was fed through a tube but was still severely malnourished. He had a line of bed sores starting from his coccyx extending up to his middle thoracic spine and most of the bones and ligaments could be clearly seen. The only real signs of life were moaning when he was turned in bed. I saw him in the icu where he was being treated for these incurable bed sores and bone infections. To me it was pure torture and his poor nurse was new to the job and broke down sobbing one day after she had to turn and clean his wounds. It was terrible for all of us. I would never want anything other than comfort care for me or my family in that situation but the families religion dictated that we continue.

jamesredman 4y ago

Except that death is fact of life, pain and suffering are not.

ako 4y ago

For some, the pain and suffering is so bad that notexisting is actually better.

bwhaley 4y ago

> Notexisting is worse than pain and suffering. That’s a stretch. Far more important to come to terms with mortality than extend life indefinitely. Is it even still living to have a heartbeat but with motor control, limited or no ability to speak, and no memory? Is “living” in this way best for the next of kin? I found a recent episode of the Making Sense podcast in this topic to be thought provoking. You might give it a listen. https://www.samharris.org/podcasts/making-sense-episodes/297-preparing-for-the-end https://www.samharris.org/podcasts/making-sense-episodes/297...

Pwhy1 4y ago

I completely disagree. I would rather not exist than be in truly agonising pain for the rest of my existence. Heck, I've had something as simple as bad food poisoning where, if it was a terminal symptom, I would have ended it.

secondcoming 4y ago

You didn't exist until you were conceived. That wasn't so bad, was it?

_qua 4y ago

A case I recall particularly vividly was a man in his late 90s who had end stage dementia to the point that he couldn’t interact with his environment or even speak. His limbs were contracted and he was permanently in a kind of fetal position. He was fed through a tube but was still severely malnourished. He had a line of bed sores starting from his coccyx extending up to his middle thoracic spine and most of the bones and ligaments could be clearly seen. The only real signs of life were moaning when he was turned in bed. I saw him in the icu where he was being treated for these incurable bed sores and bone infections. To me it was pure torture and his poor nurse was new to the job and broke down sobbing one day after she had to turn and clean his wounds. It was terrible for all of us. I would never want anything other than comfort care for me or my family in that situation but the families religion dictated that we continue.