5 ms·

I watched it live. It was uncomfortable and heartbreaking. William had a very profound experience and he wanted to explain it and thank Jeff. Jeff could not eve

I watched it live. It was uncomfortable and heartbreaking. William had a very profound experience and he wanted to explain it and thank Jeff. Jeff could not even focus long enough to let William get a few sentences out. Jeff’ s “team” (I think led by his significant other) was essentially throwing a frat party behind him - screaming ”whooo” and drinking/spraying champagne. It was sad.

thanatos519 4y ago
> It was uncomfortable and heartbreaking. Yeah. I'm squirming at the memory. Bezos says "I wanna hear this! ..." but then goes back to the party. I don't think he really wanted to hear it.
- gojomo 4y ago
  I suspect Bezos did want to hear it, but the whole emotional-mix – dominated for Bezos by his other-associates hooting-and-hollering – limited his ability to do so in the moment. Shatner, whose career & big personality I love, is probably used to being listened to. He's later-in-life than Bezos and from a career of storytelling & emotion. In that situation, I'd have rather heard Shatner's immediate thoughts, than the generic euphoria of one more successful mission. But I still don't think Bezos wronged Shatner with his divided attention. Bezos has already had the same experience. Bezos is at a earlier stage-of-life, & comes from a career of ruthless accounting & physics efficiencies. While most space-fans would be sufficiently star-struck to give Shatner the kind of focused attention that a celebrity usually gets, Bezos's own celebrity, fame, & space-experience – not to mention his personal & professional relationships to all the others there – put him far past that. I think the analogy from NYT's David Streitfeld, that this was a "Kirk/Spock" moment, is closest to the fair truth: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/13/science/bezos-shatner-star-trek.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/13/science/bezos-shatner-sta...
osigurdson 4y ago
Screaming "whooo" is legitimate behaviour after doing something exhilarating/dangerous for the first time.
- dao- 4y ago
  Your comment is legitimate as well, yet you've completely missed the point.
  - osigurdson 4y ago
    Imagine that you are in Bezos situation, you have 20 people super excited about what was just achieved (including yourself). You have one person that is reacting in a deeply philosophical way. Everyone knows that you are the leader and you set the tone. Do you want to change the tone at that moment to a deeply philosophical (and slightly non-positive) one? Being the leader is not as easy as many think. I suspect the deep philosophical discussion did happen, but perhaps at a more appropriate time.
    - SantalBlush 4y ago
      >Everyone knows that you are the leader and you set the tone. This sounds more like a presumption taken on by an arrogant person. It's certainly not a given, as you suggest here.
      - osigurdson 4y ago
        It is more of an analysis of probabilities. I suspect that this was the case but of course I don't know. What probability would you assign to Bezos being seen as the leader/setting the tone in this situation?
        SantalBlush 4y ago
        I'm rejecting the premise indicated by your forward slash, that being a team leader and setting an emotional tone for everyone involved are synonymous. The rest of the team had a sharp constrast to Shatner in their style of celebration, so which group wasn't following their leader's tone properly? And the group that was celebrating loudly was doing so independent of Bezos, but somehow required him to join in soon and give their tone his affirmation? It's an absurd idea. It makes no sense after just a bit of thought.

thanatos519 4y ago

> It was uncomfortable and heartbreaking. Yeah. I'm squirming at the memory. Bezos says "I wanna hear this! ..." but then goes back to the party. I don't think he really wanted to hear it.

gojomo 4y ago
I suspect Bezos did want to hear it, but the whole emotional-mix – dominated for Bezos by his other-associates hooting-and-hollering – limited his ability to do so in the moment. Shatner, whose career & big personality I love, is probably used to being listened to. He's later-in-life than Bezos and from a career of storytelling & emotion. In that situation, I'd have rather heard Shatner's immediate thoughts, than the generic euphoria of one more successful mission. But I still don't think Bezos wronged Shatner with his divided attention. Bezos has already had the same experience. Bezos is at a earlier stage-of-life, & comes from a career of ruthless accounting & physics efficiencies. While most space-fans would be sufficiently star-struck to give Shatner the kind of focused attention that a celebrity usually gets, Bezos's own celebrity, fame, & space-experience – not to mention his personal & professional relationships to all the others there – put him far past that. I think the analogy from NYT's David Streitfeld, that this was a "Kirk/Spock" moment, is closest to the fair truth: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/13/science/bezos-shatner-star-trek.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/13/science/bezos-shatner-sta...

osigurdson 4y ago

Screaming "whooo" is legitimate behaviour after doing something exhilarating/dangerous for the first time.

dao- 4y ago
Your comment is legitimate as well, yet you've completely missed the point.
- osigurdson 4y ago
  Imagine that you are in Bezos situation, you have 20 people super excited about what was just achieved (including yourself). You have one person that is reacting in a deeply philosophical way. Everyone knows that you are the leader and you set the tone. Do you want to change the tone at that moment to a deeply philosophical (and slightly non-positive) one? Being the leader is not as easy as many think. I suspect the deep philosophical discussion did happen, but perhaps at a more appropriate time.
  - SantalBlush 4y ago
    >Everyone knows that you are the leader and you set the tone. This sounds more like a presumption taken on by an arrogant person. It's certainly not a given, as you suggest here.
    - osigurdson 4y ago
      It is more of an analysis of probabilities. I suspect that this was the case but of course I don't know. What probability would you assign to Bezos being seen as the leader/setting the tone in this situation?
      - SantalBlush 4y ago
        I'm rejecting the premise indicated by your forward slash, that being a team leader and setting an emotional tone for everyone involved are synonymous. The rest of the team had a sharp constrast to Shatner in their style of celebration, so which group wasn't following their leader's tone properly? And the group that was celebrating loudly was doing so independent of Bezos, but somehow required him to join in soon and give their tone his affirmation? It's an absurd idea. It makes no sense after just a bit of thought.