6 ms·

I recently hired a contractor to do landscaping. We’re talking multiple trees to take down, redoing multiple flower beds, mulch, rock and some sod. I was quoted

I recently hired a contractor to do landscaping. We’re talking multiple trees to take down, redoing multiple flower beds, mulch, rock and some sod. I was quoted at ~9k$. I paid half (4500$) via Square using my platinum credit card issued by my CU. I took a picture of his business license, insurance, and I ended up getting pics of trucks when I took before pictures. The crew came and worked one day. Maybe completed 30% of the work. For the next two weeks my calls and texts were dodged/unanswered/sent directly to voicemail. Finally I had enough. I called the police, did a police report. Called the CU explained what happened and was sent an email on how to open a fraud report. I submitted all the before pictures and the “after 30% of work” pictures. I sent the police report, and social media posts of people who claimed to have their money stolen by the same person / company. 3 weeks later I get an email that my claim was denied due to “lack of information.” I spent a total of 31 hours on the phone attempting to get someone to tell me what information I needed to send them or what information they found lacking. I got absolutely no where. No answers. No one from fraud department. No one cared at all. Just denied. So I went the other route, filed a claim in small claims court. I provided the judge everything I sent to the credit union. Judgement was in my favor. Now he owes me the $4500. How do I collect? I probably will never see the money. I can’t legally garnish any wages. So I’m out 4500. I couldn’t really do anything else to protect myself more. Navy Federal Credit Union. I’ve been a member since 1991. 30 years with a credit union. I am a military veteran. Hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of transactions have passed through my account. I’ve had multiple home, auto and personal loans. I’m still trying to get over it.

mixmastamyk 4y ago
Chargeback.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
NovemberWhiskey 4y ago
>So I went the other route, filed a claim in small claims court. I provided the judge everything I sent to the credit union. Judgement was in my favor. Now he owes me the $4500. How do I collect? I can’t legally garnish any wages. Where I live, after 30 days of the debtor failing to pay the judgment, you'd make an appointment with the sheriff, bring a check for $35 and they'd attempt to enforce it for you; including garnishing wages, seizing property (real or personal) etc etc. I'm not surprised you didn't get far with police reports and fraud filings: breach of contract is not necessarily fraud.
- vuln 4y ago
  .
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
tdiggity 4y ago
A similar thing happened to me where a contractor bait and switched me. Put down a 50% deposit and he said it was non refundable. I wrote it off thinking I’d never get it back. I got extremely lucky though in that a detective in a nearby city emailed me and said this contractor had ripped off a lot of people and he was investigating. A few weeks later, they refunded my deposit. It seems like once the police got involved, they were willing to play ball. Somehow, you’ve got to find the contractor and get the police on your side. You’ve got his business addresses and even insurances, maybe the insurance company is your way in? Good luck.
- factsarelolz 4y ago
  Sorry I forgot to mention the insurance part and I can no longer edit my post. When I looked at the insurance and took a picture the policy dates were valid. When I attempted to call the insurance company the policy was started then canceled due to lack of payment so he probably only made the first payment. Lesson learned is to call to verify on the spot. Never thought of it. The police just look at my slip of paper from the glovebox.
  - flutas 4y ago
    > The police just look at my slip of paper from the glovebox. They already know if you have insurance typically. Their in-car computers can typically reference insurance accounts (or at least in my technologically backwards state they can).
    - factsarelolz 4y ago
      I still get asked for it…
      - MerelyMortal 4y ago
        Because it's an easy thing to ticket if you don't have proof of insurance (even if you do have insurance).
  - 4y ago
breck 4y ago
- factsarelolz 4y ago
  Ummm okay. Guy won’t even answer the phone or attempt to give me even a half decent excuse on why they never showed back up. If he does ever call or text I’ll be sure to buy him a beer to see if we can resolve the situation.
  - breck 4y ago
    A sampler is good. In general I've found a good rule of thumb with people is: Flight or "flight".
77pt77 4y ago
> I can’t legally garnish any wages. Why not? You have a judgment in your favor. Send it to collections.
monkmartinez 4y ago
Are you in the USA? I just did some googling on this as I was unaware of laws regarding the garnishment of wages. I have subordinates that have wages garnished for Child Support every paycheck. At least in my state, you can most certainly garnish wages/property for a judgement in your favor. It will probably take a bit more time, but I would stick it out to get my money back. If the contractor has nice Stihl saws, I would remand some $$$ to get one of them from him. Possibly even the truck as the contractor has probably depreciated the asset for tax reasons. [0]https://www.azcourts.gov/selfservicecenter/Garnishment/Garnishment-of-Earnings https://www.azcourts.gov/selfservicecenter/Garnishment/Garni...
jcadam 4y ago
NFCU and USAA have both gone way down hill. They are coasting on their previously earned reputations but are no better than anyone else nowadays.
- factsarelolz 4y ago
  I wholeheartedly agree. It’s very very sad.
ianai 4y ago
How far off of 50% of the work was the work they performed? Could it have been a simple case of they did about half the work for the pay you gave? Maybe that'd be how I'd square it with myself. (But still probably never working with people who ghost again.) You paid 50% and got less than 50% of the work done, but work was still done - somewhere between 25% and 50% it sounds like. It'd also help the personal re-framing if the next people I hired quoted less for the remaining work and it was done in a day. Granted, this is work with plants and things which change/increase in entropy by the day. The possible life lesson here is to not let perception or preconception sour an otherwise sort of alright outcome. And sometimes outright re-framing a sour situation can diminish the sting. (Along the lines of "breakups hurt, but enjoy the good times and memories for what they were.") There's also not letting sunk costs steer decisions towards still worse outcomes.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- factsarelolz 4y ago
  1 tons of river rock, 1800 sqft of mulch, and 2 pallets of sod were never delivered or installed/spread. 2 of the 5 trees were completely cut down and cut into pieces but not removed. Stumps were not ground down on the two trees that were taken down. Some of the branches were removed from the other trees and just left there. As soon as it hit 5pm the team gathered their tools and left. I was on the hook for clean up.
  - ianai 4y ago
    How big were the trees? But yeah just trying to pass along a mental trick that helps me sometimes accept painful outcomes. It’s not great though clearly.
ncallaway 4y ago
I'm not sure what state you're in, but when something similar happened to a friend I found that Connecticut has a Home Improvement Guaranty Fund (https://portal.ct.gov/DCP/Common-Elements/Consumer-Facts-and-Contacts/Home-Improvement-Guaranty-Fund https://portal.ct.gov/DCP/Common-Elements/Consumer-Facts-and...) which exists to satisfy an unpaid judgment for up to $25,000. I don't know about most states, but I know at least Maryland has a similar fund. I'd recommend checking to see if your state has a similar program.
danielmarkbruce 4y ago
Did you do a reference check?
- factsarelolz 4y ago
  This part I could have been more thorough with. Facebook and Google business pages had high, aged reviews including pictures. Googling the company name didn’t come up with any open BBB claims even though BBB is a joke. It wasn’t until I started joining and searching through all of the local Facebook groups to find others swindled.
  - danielmarkbruce 4y ago
    Yeah, I guess that's about the optimal amount of checking for most things. I recently had some work done and did a decent amount of checking but it still felt like a 50/50 chance of getting taken for a ride...
Merad 4y ago
I'm not too surprised the fraud claim was denied. You definitely made the payment, you paid a [technically] legitimate business, and they completed some of the work, i.e. it's hard to say they accepted the payment with intent to defraud you. The fact that they didn't fully complete the agreed work isn't really a matter for the bank's fraud department to resolve. Dunno why NFCU couldn't just communicate that though. Sounds like a shamefully poor support experience on their part.
robswc 4y ago
So sorry to hear this. Makes my blood boil… can’t stand fraudsters. Can’t stand how they’re basically able to do this because some bureaucracy going on behind the scenes. I see so many horror stories about contractors pulling stuff like this on FB. yes, even when they are licensed (admittedly a lot more unlicensed tough). Does anyone know how/why this is so prevalent?
- Ekaros 4y ago
  Blame the police and judicial system. In efficient system they would be in jail. Maybe it is fault of the voters they haven't voted enough politicians who invest in the system and laws to sufficiently punish these people.
  - robswc 4y ago
    While I agree... I feel this is easier said than done. I don't think any sane person would be against letting fraudsters get away with outright scams. It seems if OP was able to just have their re-payments enforced, things would be set right.
andrewmcwatters 4y ago
Did you consider making a claim against his insurance? Or taking up matters with your state's corporation commission? Or talk to your attorney general or your consumer protection department? You have options.

mixmastamyk 4y ago

Chargeback.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

NovemberWhiskey 4y ago

>So I went the other route, filed a claim in small claims court. I provided the judge everything I sent to the credit union. Judgement was in my favor. Now he owes me the $4500. How do I collect? I can’t legally garnish any wages. Where I live, after 30 days of the debtor failing to pay the judgment, you'd make an appointment with the sheriff, bring a check for $35 and they'd attempt to enforce it for you; including garnishing wages, seizing property (real or personal) etc etc. I'm not surprised you didn't get far with police reports and fraud filings: breach of contract is not necessarily fraud.

vuln 4y ago
.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]

tdiggity 4y ago

A similar thing happened to me where a contractor bait and switched me. Put down a 50% deposit and he said it was non refundable. I wrote it off thinking I’d never get it back. I got extremely lucky though in that a detective in a nearby city emailed me and said this contractor had ripped off a lot of people and he was investigating. A few weeks later, they refunded my deposit. It seems like once the police got involved, they were willing to play ball. Somehow, you’ve got to find the contractor and get the police on your side. You’ve got his business addresses and even insurances, maybe the insurance company is your way in? Good luck.

factsarelolz 4y ago
Sorry I forgot to mention the insurance part and I can no longer edit my post. When I looked at the insurance and took a picture the policy dates were valid. When I attempted to call the insurance company the policy was started then canceled due to lack of payment so he probably only made the first payment. Lesson learned is to call to verify on the spot. Never thought of it. The police just look at my slip of paper from the glovebox.
- flutas 4y ago
  > The police just look at my slip of paper from the glovebox. They already know if you have insurance typically. Their in-car computers can typically reference insurance accounts (or at least in my technologically backwards state they can).
  - factsarelolz 4y ago
    I still get asked for it…
    - MerelyMortal 4y ago
      Because it's an easy thing to ticket if you don't have proof of insurance (even if you do have insurance).
- 4y ago

breck 4y ago

factsarelolz 4y ago
Ummm okay. Guy won’t even answer the phone or attempt to give me even a half decent excuse on why they never showed back up. If he does ever call or text I’ll be sure to buy him a beer to see if we can resolve the situation.
- breck 4y ago
  A sampler is good. In general I've found a good rule of thumb with people is: Flight or "flight".

77pt77 4y ago

> I can’t legally garnish any wages. Why not? You have a judgment in your favor. Send it to collections.

monkmartinez 4y ago

Are you in the USA? I just did some googling on this as I was unaware of laws regarding the garnishment of wages. I have subordinates that have wages garnished for Child Support every paycheck. At least in my state, you can most certainly garnish wages/property for a judgement in your favor. It will probably take a bit more time, but I would stick it out to get my money back. If the contractor has nice Stihl saws, I would remand some $$$ to get one of them from him. Possibly even the truck as the contractor has probably depreciated the asset for tax reasons. [0]https://www.azcourts.gov/selfservicecenter/Garnishment/Garnishment-of-Earnings https://www.azcourts.gov/selfservicecenter/Garnishment/Garni...

jcadam 4y ago

NFCU and USAA have both gone way down hill. They are coasting on their previously earned reputations but are no better than anyone else nowadays.

factsarelolz 4y ago
I wholeheartedly agree. It’s very very sad.

ianai 4y ago

How far off of 50% of the work was the work they performed? Could it have been a simple case of they did about half the work for the pay you gave? Maybe that'd be how I'd square it with myself. (But still probably never working with people who ghost again.) You paid 50% and got less than 50% of the work done, but work was still done - somewhere between 25% and 50% it sounds like. It'd also help the personal re-framing if the next people I hired quoted less for the remaining work and it was done in a day. Granted, this is work with plants and things which change/increase in entropy by the day. The possible life lesson here is to not let perception or preconception sour an otherwise sort of alright outcome. And sometimes outright re-framing a sour situation can diminish the sting. (Along the lines of "breakups hurt, but enjoy the good times and memories for what they were.") There's also not letting sunk costs steer decisions towards still worse outcomes.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
factsarelolz 4y ago
1 tons of river rock, 1800 sqft of mulch, and 2 pallets of sod were never delivered or installed/spread. 2 of the 5 trees were completely cut down and cut into pieces but not removed. Stumps were not ground down on the two trees that were taken down. Some of the branches were removed from the other trees and just left there. As soon as it hit 5pm the team gathered their tools and left. I was on the hook for clean up.
- ianai 4y ago
  How big were the trees? But yeah just trying to pass along a mental trick that helps me sometimes accept painful outcomes. It’s not great though clearly.

ncallaway 4y ago

I'm not sure what state you're in, but when something similar happened to a friend I found that Connecticut has a Home Improvement Guaranty Fund (https://portal.ct.gov/DCP/Common-Elements/Consumer-Facts-and-Contacts/Home-Improvement-Guaranty-Fund https://portal.ct.gov/DCP/Common-Elements/Consumer-Facts-and...) which exists to satisfy an unpaid judgment for up to $25,000. I don't know about most states, but I know at least Maryland has a similar fund. I'd recommend checking to see if your state has a similar program.

danielmarkbruce 4y ago

Did you do a reference check?

factsarelolz 4y ago
This part I could have been more thorough with. Facebook and Google business pages had high, aged reviews including pictures. Googling the company name didn’t come up with any open BBB claims even though BBB is a joke. It wasn’t until I started joining and searching through all of the local Facebook groups to find others swindled.
- danielmarkbruce 4y ago
  Yeah, I guess that's about the optimal amount of checking for most things. I recently had some work done and did a decent amount of checking but it still felt like a 50/50 chance of getting taken for a ride...

Merad 4y ago

I'm not too surprised the fraud claim was denied. You definitely made the payment, you paid a [technically] legitimate business, and they completed some of the work, i.e. it's hard to say they accepted the payment with intent to defraud you. The fact that they didn't fully complete the agreed work isn't really a matter for the bank's fraud department to resolve. Dunno why NFCU couldn't just communicate that though. Sounds like a shamefully poor support experience on their part.

robswc 4y ago

So sorry to hear this. Makes my blood boil… can’t stand fraudsters. Can’t stand how they’re basically able to do this because some bureaucracy going on behind the scenes. I see so many horror stories about contractors pulling stuff like this on FB. yes, even when they are licensed (admittedly a lot more unlicensed tough). Does anyone know how/why this is so prevalent?

Ekaros 4y ago
Blame the police and judicial system. In efficient system they would be in jail. Maybe it is fault of the voters they haven't voted enough politicians who invest in the system and laws to sufficiently punish these people.
- robswc 4y ago
  While I agree... I feel this is easier said than done. I don't think any sane person would be against letting fraudsters get away with outright scams. It seems if OP was able to just have their re-payments enforced, things would be set right.

andrewmcwatters 4y ago

Did you consider making a claim against his insurance? Or taking up matters with your state's corporation commission? Or talk to your attorney general or your consumer protection department? You have options.