5 ms·

Apple’s use of Swift and SwiftUI in iOS 16

59 points by WoodenChair 4y ago

WoodenChair 4y ago
"When performing this analysis, one number surprised me: iOS 16 only contains 4 apps using the SwiftUI-based app lifecycle: /Applications/Batteries.app/Batteries /Applications/FTMInternal-4.app/FTMInternal-4 /private/var/staged_system_apps/Weather.app/Weather /System/Library/CoreServices/AegirProxyApp.app/AegirProxyApp "
- bobulous 4y ago
  This makes sense since only apps (re)built from the ground up would use the SwiftUI lifecycle instead of the UIKit compatibility layer
- lloydatkinson 4y ago
  There’s something about weather apps. Across platforms whether desktop apps or mobile or web, weather apps seem to get rewritten/refactored the most. I wonder why that is? Is it because it’s perceived as a “lower risk” to try out new tech like SwiftUI on “smaller” features like weather? If it is, why is it so often weather and not for example calculator apps? One example I can think of is the weather apps between Windows 8, 10 and 11.
  - furyofantares 4y ago
    Weather apps seem like a good UI playground. Lots of different types of widget, and if you change the UI it's not a big deal. Changing the UI for something more complex that people had to learn and now have to relearrn, in software that people work with (rather than just getting info from), tends to be really negative for users. Much less the case for a weather app I think than a calculator.
    - lloydatkinson 4y ago
      Yeah good points, thanks!
newZWhoDis 4y ago
Swift passing C++ is a big deal
- pjmlp 4y ago
  It is, Apple moving focus away from clang is one of the reasons why clang is now lagging ISO C++ support, in an honorable 3rd place, if we don't count all those UNIX, mainframe and embedded compilers that still exist outside of the big three. C++ on Apple plaforms is mostly used for Metal Shading Language (a C++14 dialect), IO and Driver Kit (with IO Kit being an Embedded C++ dialect), and the minimum ISO required for LLVM (ISO C++17). Google likewise is mostly focused on what their style guide allows, is adopting Rust and now ex-clang contributors came up with Carbon. From all mainstream OS vendors, Microsoft is the only one that still doubles down on C++, no wonder that VC++ has the best support for ISO C++20.
  - HexDecOctBin 4y ago
    So who if so many big actors are losing interest, who is driving the ISO committee? Are we bound to see more conservative standards in the future, or are the remaining people going to turn the place into even more of a madhouse?
    - pjmlp 4y ago
      About 350 people that go through the effort to submit papers, fight for them until the voting, everything that wins feature election lands into next ISO round. Stuff being in ISO doesn't imply compiler vendors will bother with such features, see exported templates, which only EDG bothered with, everyone else ignored them, and eventually got replaced with external templates instead. EDIT: Bjarne also has only one vote like everyone else, thus this paper from him is quite relevant, https://www.stroustrup.com/P0977-remember-the-vasa.pdf https://www.stroustrup.com/P0977-remember-the-vasa.pdf
      - HexDecOctBin 4y ago
        > About 350 people that go through the effort to submit papers, fight for them until the voting, everything that wins feature election lands into next ISO round. But what would be the point if major compilers refuse to implement these features? C++ is complex enough that it won't be easy (or even plausible?) for a new interested party to develop a high quality compiler. Is C++ going to become Microsoft's plaything?
jabedude 4y ago
You should do the same for macOS! Cool analysis, I appreciate it
- weikju 4y ago
  The author has done so, in August - https://blog.timac.org/2022/0818-state-of-appkit-catalyst-swiftui-mac/ https://blog.timac.org/2022/0818-state-of-appkit-catalyst-sw...

59 points by WoodenChair 4y ago

"When performing this analysis, one number surprised me: iOS 16 only contains 4 apps using the SwiftUI-based app lifecycle: /Applications/Batteries.app/Batteries /Applications/FTMInternal-4.app/FTMInternal-4 /private/var/staged_system_apps/Weather.app/Weather /System/Library/CoreServices/AegirProxyApp.app/AegirProxyApp "

bobulous 4y ago
This makes sense since only apps (re)built from the ground up would use the SwiftUI lifecycle instead of the UIKit compatibility layer
lloydatkinson 4y ago
There’s something about weather apps. Across platforms whether desktop apps or mobile or web, weather apps seem to get rewritten/refactored the most. I wonder why that is? Is it because it’s perceived as a “lower risk” to try out new tech like SwiftUI on “smaller” features like weather? If it is, why is it so often weather and not for example calculator apps? One example I can think of is the weather apps between Windows 8, 10 and 11.
- furyofantares 4y ago
  Weather apps seem like a good UI playground. Lots of different types of widget, and if you change the UI it's not a big deal. Changing the UI for something more complex that people had to learn and now have to relearrn, in software that people work with (rather than just getting info from), tends to be really negative for users. Much less the case for a weather app I think than a calculator.
  - lloydatkinson 4y ago
    Yeah good points, thanks!

newZWhoDis 4y ago

Swift passing C++ is a big deal

pjmlp 4y ago
It is, Apple moving focus away from clang is one of the reasons why clang is now lagging ISO C++ support, in an honorable 3rd place, if we don't count all those UNIX, mainframe and embedded compilers that still exist outside of the big three. C++ on Apple plaforms is mostly used for Metal Shading Language (a C++14 dialect), IO and Driver Kit (with IO Kit being an Embedded C++ dialect), and the minimum ISO required for LLVM (ISO C++17). Google likewise is mostly focused on what their style guide allows, is adopting Rust and now ex-clang contributors came up with Carbon. From all mainstream OS vendors, Microsoft is the only one that still doubles down on C++, no wonder that VC++ has the best support for ISO C++20.
- HexDecOctBin 4y ago
  So who if so many big actors are losing interest, who is driving the ISO committee? Are we bound to see more conservative standards in the future, or are the remaining people going to turn the place into even more of a madhouse?
  - pjmlp 4y ago
    About 350 people that go through the effort to submit papers, fight for them until the voting, everything that wins feature election lands into next ISO round. Stuff being in ISO doesn't imply compiler vendors will bother with such features, see exported templates, which only EDG bothered with, everyone else ignored them, and eventually got replaced with external templates instead. EDIT: Bjarne also has only one vote like everyone else, thus this paper from him is quite relevant, https://www.stroustrup.com/P0977-remember-the-vasa.pdf https://www.stroustrup.com/P0977-remember-the-vasa.pdf
    - HexDecOctBin 4y ago
      > About 350 people that go through the effort to submit papers, fight for them until the voting, everything that wins feature election lands into next ISO round. But what would be the point if major compilers refuse to implement these features? C++ is complex enough that it won't be easy (or even plausible?) for a new interested party to develop a high quality compiler. Is C++ going to become Microsoft's plaything?

jabedude 4y ago

You should do the same for macOS! Cool analysis, I appreciate it

weikju 4y ago
The author has done so, in August - https://blog.timac.org/2022/0818-state-of-appkit-catalyst-swiftui-mac/ https://blog.timac.org/2022/0818-state-of-appkit-catalyst-sw...