4 ms·

> "you're using it wrong" from the developers This kinda response is common with Signal. It won’t even allow backups on iOS and refuses to handle scenarios whe

> "you're using it wrong" from the developers This kinda response is common with Signal. It won’t even allow backups on iOS and refuses to handle scenarios where one may have a broken device or a lost device (the only way to retain chats and change devices is through a device-to-device transfer when they’re in close proximity; there is no iOS<->Android chat transfer either). Signal seems like it’s meant for chats that don’t have much value, where losing messages isn’t a big deal. But the app, at least on iOS, will never stop pestering you often if you don’t give it access to contacts. Something is broken between the vision for the platform and the implementation.

sbf501 4y ago
IMHO, anonymity takes a certain amount of unavoidable effort. If you're just chatting with friends, maybe you really don't need Signal. If you are whistleblowing a large corporation or a government, then it makes more sense?
- brandonr49 4y ago
  A significant value of implementing security as "normal" or by default is that you don't look suspicious for having it.
  - sbf501 4y ago
    Agreed. Think of all the other things we have come to take as normal. Carrying car keys (or a fob) House keys. Wallets. IDs. They all require some mental effort.
- Semaphor 4y ago
  > IMHO, anonymity takes a certain amount of unavoidable effort. If anonymity was a factor, and not ease of use, they’d never only allow phone numbers as login.
  - sbf501 4y ago
    After reading this thread, it seems like a necessary paradox. Some quotes in here claim that to use some other number doesn't really allieviate that risk since it is effectively transferred to the signal servers. E.g., there's no way to get around that fact that you must be identified to communicate, it is a matter of who owns that ID ... Hence the paradox. (I may be misunderstanding here.)
    - Semaphor 4y ago
      Phone numbers are, in some countries including Germany, tied to your identity (as in you can’t even get a number without government issued ID), it doesn’t get much worse for an identifier if anonymity is the goal.
      - sbf501 4y ago
        So ultimately this is a service-provider problem? E.g., signal with server issued ID?
        Semaphor 4y ago
        It’s the law here, KYC for phone numbers. So even a pseudonym would be better.
merely-unlikely 4y ago
If you want a backup just copy the sqlite database from the Desktop app. The encryption key is stored in a json in the same folder. Not as convenient as an iOS backup admittedly.

sbf501 4y ago

IMHO, anonymity takes a certain amount of unavoidable effort. If you're just chatting with friends, maybe you really don't need Signal. If you are whistleblowing a large corporation or a government, then it makes more sense?

brandonr49 4y ago
A significant value of implementing security as "normal" or by default is that you don't look suspicious for having it.
- sbf501 4y ago
  Agreed. Think of all the other things we have come to take as normal. Carrying car keys (or a fob) House keys. Wallets. IDs. They all require some mental effort.
Semaphor 4y ago
> IMHO, anonymity takes a certain amount of unavoidable effort. If anonymity was a factor, and not ease of use, they’d never only allow phone numbers as login.
- sbf501 4y ago
  After reading this thread, it seems like a necessary paradox. Some quotes in here claim that to use some other number doesn't really allieviate that risk since it is effectively transferred to the signal servers. E.g., there's no way to get around that fact that you must be identified to communicate, it is a matter of who owns that ID ... Hence the paradox. (I may be misunderstanding here.)
  - Semaphor 4y ago
    Phone numbers are, in some countries including Germany, tied to your identity (as in you can’t even get a number without government issued ID), it doesn’t get much worse for an identifier if anonymity is the goal.
    - sbf501 4y ago
      So ultimately this is a service-provider problem? E.g., signal with server issued ID?
      - Semaphor 4y ago
        It’s the law here, KYC for phone numbers. So even a pseudonym would be better.

merely-unlikely 4y ago

If you want a backup just copy the sqlite database from the Desktop app. The encryption key is stored in a json in the same folder. Not as convenient as an iOS backup admittedly.