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> 1 - Children under 13 are way, way different than a 16 year old. They both do 'stupid' things, of course. Middle school age children are probably most suscept

> 1 - Children under 13 are way, way different than a 16 year old. They both do 'stupid' things, of course. Middle school age children are probably most susceptible to about everything. "Stupidity" is, in most cases, inexperience. By withholding their ability to experience the Internet until their teens, your children be worse off than less intelligent teens with years more experience in navigating the web. They'll likely ending up repeating the same mistakes at 13 that they're cohorts learned from at 5. All you're doing is delaying the inevitable. > 2 - Kids don't need the internet to become responsible adults. We have thousands of years of examples proving as much. I think it is perfectly reasonable to raise kids with heavily restricted internet, or no internet at all if the parents so choose. That's become less true as more institutions and information sources move online. Sure, parents have the right to heavily restrict what information their kids learn in their homes. That's what the religiously fanatical do when they homeschool their kids. But the outcome of that is often one where children lack the ability to be self-sufficient adults at the appropriate age. Hiding what people on the Internet do or say won't save your kids, only stifle them.

jmathai 4y ago
Every parent will have different philosophies and every child matures at different rates. That being said, we have continued to push back the age when our kids have an internet connected device of their own (oldest is a 7th grade / 12yo boy). Went with an Apple Watch with cellular so my son could text his friends and listen to music. Neither him or his 2 year younger sister can be on a laptop in private. I use NextDNS to block a bunch of sites. They don’t have any social media accounts. This sounds draconian. But the stuff kids can stumble upon online is terrible and I don’t buy into the idea that they’ll learn through experience. I think many people don’t realize how under developed a child’s brain is.
- Dracophoenix 4y ago
  > Every parent will have different philosophies and every child matures at different rates. While I agree that every child matures at different rates, "maturity" as a term is a weasel word that says more about a parent's beliefs and expectations than any objective evaluation of a person's psychological state. Parental philosophy and biological maturity are orthogonal at best. Every parental system makes certain assumptions that turn out to be untrue/self-contradictory or become outmoded as the child grows up. People learn things in spite of their parents, not because of them. The only successful parental philosophies are the ones the allow the child to grow into himself while giving him a clear view of the world as it is. > That being said, we have continued to push back the age when our kids have an internet connected device of their own (oldest is a 7th grade / 12yo boy). Went with an Apple Watch with cellular so my son could text his friends and listen to music. Neither him or his 2 year younger sister can be on a laptop in private. I use NextDNS to block a bunch of sites. They don’t have any social media accounts. Oddly enough, the inverse occurred in my case. My parents more or less policed the music I listened to until I was about ten (that wasn't hard to do when music came on CDs). They also wouldn't let me have a feature phone until I was your son's age, but I already had my own laptop by then, albeit one only permitted for use on weekends. I probably learned more about the world from all the time I've spent in front of a screen than I have from my parents or anyone else. While I personally didn't have a Facebook account when that was all the rage, that was a decision I made for myself. Given that your son is almost a teen,your son's friends are likely on some form of social media and he's probably miss out on socializing with them beyond texting and calling. That is unless he's more of a loner like I was at that age. > This sounds draconian. But the stuff kids can stumble upon online is terrible and I don’t buy into the idea that they’ll learn through experience. How and when did you learn to operate a computer yourself? How did you make your way to this forum? Your kids can stumble upon a dead body in the real world. The internet is no more and no less gruesome than the events that occur in the real world. > I think many people don’t realize how under developed a child’s brain is. If a child's mind is developed enough to understand actions, consequences, and responsibilities, they have the ability to understand how to use a computer. Eventually, they're going to look up stuff you don't like. Even Wikipedia will provide explicit pictures of sexual acts if you type in words like "fellatio".
  - jmathai 4y ago
    I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said and I’m not sure if you’re a parent. But I quickly realized that raising an actual human defies most of what I thought would work. I think computers are great. Is the stuff computers introduce kids to that I don’t particularly care for which is much different than when I got online in 1995. I’m much less concerned with my kid looking up “fellatio” out of curiosity than I am them developing addiction to instant gratification by playing games like Roblox where adults engineer them purposely to manipulate people’s psychological weakness to make profit. That may sound extreme but I’m not sure it is inaccurate.
    - silisili 4y ago
      This is pretty much my stance. Kids searching for things out of curiosity is no problem...kid has full access to wikipedia and Google search app. Who cares if she sees a private part, especially in some educational context. Social media is a cancer, and anything that opens them up to random chats and DMs might as well be injecting her brain with a cocktail of insecurity, pedophiles, and dick pics directly. The internet certainly has its good parts, but most kids today seem more interested(naturally) in the addictive parts. When she's 18 she can do whatever she wants. And maybe she'll resent me for it. I just hope that she understands I was doing what I thought was best, not being some strict ahole. Time will tell.
      - jmathai 4y ago
        The intent of Wikipedia vs. Pornhub are so different. The difference in outcome of seeing fellatio on those sites are not even comparable.
jdlshore 4y ago
> They'll likely ending up repeating the same mistakes at 13 that they're cohorts learned from at 5. All you're doing is delaying the inevitable. To add to that, younger kids are much more “teachable” than teens. Young kids want to be guided and soak up information like a sieve, particularly through imitation. Teens want to strike out on their own and discover things for themselves. They overestimate their ability and underestimate risk. It’s much more dangerous to be an uneducated “sneaking out” teen on the Internet than an uneducated and monitored younger child.

jmathai 4y ago

Every parent will have different philosophies and every child matures at different rates. That being said, we have continued to push back the age when our kids have an internet connected device of their own (oldest is a 7th grade / 12yo boy). Went with an Apple Watch with cellular so my son could text his friends and listen to music. Neither him or his 2 year younger sister can be on a laptop in private. I use NextDNS to block a bunch of sites. They don’t have any social media accounts. This sounds draconian. But the stuff kids can stumble upon online is terrible and I don’t buy into the idea that they’ll learn through experience. I think many people don’t realize how under developed a child’s brain is.

Dracophoenix 4y ago
> Every parent will have different philosophies and every child matures at different rates. While I agree that every child matures at different rates, "maturity" as a term is a weasel word that says more about a parent's beliefs and expectations than any objective evaluation of a person's psychological state. Parental philosophy and biological maturity are orthogonal at best. Every parental system makes certain assumptions that turn out to be untrue/self-contradictory or become outmoded as the child grows up. People learn things in spite of their parents, not because of them. The only successful parental philosophies are the ones the allow the child to grow into himself while giving him a clear view of the world as it is. > That being said, we have continued to push back the age when our kids have an internet connected device of their own (oldest is a 7th grade / 12yo boy). Went with an Apple Watch with cellular so my son could text his friends and listen to music. Neither him or his 2 year younger sister can be on a laptop in private. I use NextDNS to block a bunch of sites. They don’t have any social media accounts. Oddly enough, the inverse occurred in my case. My parents more or less policed the music I listened to until I was about ten (that wasn't hard to do when music came on CDs). They also wouldn't let me have a feature phone until I was your son's age, but I already had my own laptop by then, albeit one only permitted for use on weekends. I probably learned more about the world from all the time I've spent in front of a screen than I have from my parents or anyone else. While I personally didn't have a Facebook account when that was all the rage, that was a decision I made for myself. Given that your son is almost a teen,your son's friends are likely on some form of social media and he's probably miss out on socializing with them beyond texting and calling. That is unless he's more of a loner like I was at that age. > This sounds draconian. But the stuff kids can stumble upon online is terrible and I don’t buy into the idea that they’ll learn through experience. How and when did you learn to operate a computer yourself? How did you make your way to this forum? Your kids can stumble upon a dead body in the real world. The internet is no more and no less gruesome than the events that occur in the real world. > I think many people don’t realize how under developed a child’s brain is. If a child's mind is developed enough to understand actions, consequences, and responsibilities, they have the ability to understand how to use a computer. Eventually, they're going to look up stuff you don't like. Even Wikipedia will provide explicit pictures of sexual acts if you type in words like "fellatio".
- jmathai 4y ago
  I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said and I’m not sure if you’re a parent. But I quickly realized that raising an actual human defies most of what I thought would work. I think computers are great. Is the stuff computers introduce kids to that I don’t particularly care for which is much different than when I got online in 1995. I’m much less concerned with my kid looking up “fellatio” out of curiosity than I am them developing addiction to instant gratification by playing games like Roblox where adults engineer them purposely to manipulate people’s psychological weakness to make profit. That may sound extreme but I’m not sure it is inaccurate.
  - silisili 4y ago
    This is pretty much my stance. Kids searching for things out of curiosity is no problem...kid has full access to wikipedia and Google search app. Who cares if she sees a private part, especially in some educational context. Social media is a cancer, and anything that opens them up to random chats and DMs might as well be injecting her brain with a cocktail of insecurity, pedophiles, and dick pics directly. The internet certainly has its good parts, but most kids today seem more interested(naturally) in the addictive parts. When she's 18 she can do whatever she wants. And maybe she'll resent me for it. I just hope that she understands I was doing what I thought was best, not being some strict ahole. Time will tell.
    - jmathai 4y ago
      The intent of Wikipedia vs. Pornhub are so different. The difference in outcome of seeing fellatio on those sites are not even comparable.

jdlshore 4y ago

> They'll likely ending up repeating the same mistakes at 13 that they're cohorts learned from at 5. All you're doing is delaying the inevitable. To add to that, younger kids are much more “teachable” than teens. Young kids want to be guided and soak up information like a sieve, particularly through imitation. Teens want to strike out on their own and discover things for themselves. They overestimate their ability and underestimate risk. It’s much more dangerous to be an uneducated “sneaking out” teen on the Internet than an uneducated and monitored younger child.