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After cutting radar, Tesla now dropping ultrasonic sensors from its EVs
- chrisbolt 4y agoDupe: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33086768 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33086768
- kidme5 4y agoBesides supply chain, CyberTruck won't have them because it's all stainless steel and won't integrate into the body easily. Seems like this is a forcing function preparing for that.
- potatochup 4y agoI disagree. What makes stainless steel more complicated than painted steel/aluminum? The Model X already has totally internal ultrasonic sensors facing outwards on the falcon doors. I don't see why that couldn't be repeated with the stainless cybertruck
- pmcollins 4y agohttps://twitter.com/brandonee916/status/1577448444112707585 https://twitter.com/brandonee916/status/1577448444112707585
- arcticbull 4y agoAlso, I suspect they won't work when the CyberTruck is "temporarily serving as a boat" - although maybe that's a good opportunity to throw on a sonar? [edit] Maybe even some kind of fish-finder.
- GenerocUsername 4y agoIntroducing Tesla Ankor.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- olivermarks 4y agoThe new Tesla Vaporware detector will ensure that you will be warned if the stainless steel 'cybertruck' ever actually makes it to production, along with all the sports car and all the other late night TV 'but wait there's more' pitches Musk enthusiasts seem to find so compelling
- senectus1 4y agosurely the visual spectrum is one of the most unreliable ways to "see" the world (in a computing sense).
- rlt 4y agoThen why did we evolve to only be able to see visual spectrum?
- vlovich123 4y agoReally? A) our visual system is several orders of magnitude better than the best CV systems (both in terms of optical sensor + the wetware that does object recognition, focus, etc etc). That doesn’t mean that artificial systems we build can get away with just one B) our visual system works on coarse approximations with high latency. Radio vision systems operate with far more accuracy / precision and lower latency C) our visual system fails in inclement conditions (heavy rain, fog, night). Radio vision systems complement by filling that gap D) sensor fusion done well should strictly outperform any single sensor E) we evolved for the visual spectrum because of our history of reproductive selection as a species. This in no way says anything about the optimal artificial system design F) our visual system fails ALL the friggin time. Remember “check your blind spot”? Our visual system has major blood vessels going in front of the lens which is unnecessary but there’s no evolutionary pressure on us to fix that because our brain compensated for that defect. G) the goal for self driving systems is to be not just at par with humans, but several orders of magnitude safer with 24/7 uptime and driving. We have no evidence to suggest that’s possible with just vision.
- steve_adams_86 4y agoBecause it works well enough. Our vision system is full of weird illusions and nonsense though. If you burn part of your retina, you won’t even know unless it’s severe enough. Your brain will “fill in the gap” as long as it can. Is that what you want driving your car?
- me_me_me 4y agoThis is most banal and boring answer, that is also most likely to correct answer. Just simple example of good enough design are our eyes; they evolved inside out (we have nerves in front of instead behind the eye) and our brain just fills the gaps, but its good enough to see lions in the bushes. And so we are stuck with it. If black and white was good enough for survival we would have black and white vision.
- c-linkage 4y agoI have a 2020 Honda Civic sans ultrasonic sensors but with a front camera for collision avoidance, and I can count on two hands the number of phantom breaking events I've had in two years. All it takes is a little rain and the sun at the right angle for the system to be fooled into thinking a wall lies dead ahead. I consider myself lucky that each time there was no one behind me. While the car gives me the option to turn of the feature, I leave it on because if I get into an accident with it off I am sure the insurance companies would have more leverage to deny my claims and find me at fault.
- jeffbee 4y agoHonda's collision mitigation system uses a millimeter-wave radar mounted in the front bumper on the driver's side. https://www.hondapartsnow.com/genuine/honda~0~36803-tbe-a04.html https://www.hondapartsnow.com/genuine/honda~0~36803-tbe-a04....
- threeseed 4y agoAccording to owner's guide [1] it uses both a front camera and radar. I can definitely imagine it relying on the camera for medium to long range collision avoidance. [1] https://owners.honda.com/utility/download?path=/static/pdfs/2021/Civic%20Sedan/2021_Civic_4D_Honda_Sensing.pdf https://owners.honda.com/utility/download?path=/static/pdfs/...
- AtomicOrbital 4y agoThe car no doubt first confirms nobody is tailgating before such an abrupt action
- peteradio 4y agoI heard they are getting new sensors that detect a collision via an interference with Musks giant ego.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- ilrwbwrkhv 4y agoThey can do whatever they want. Moved away from the Tesla now to the Porsche and the Rivian. The model s was a great car for it's time but now others have caught up.
- sinclairX86 4y agoI just bought a Model Y. For their price, Teslas are great. I believe it feeds my car fomo for 6-10 years, and my family's car needs for longer. You can get a nicer looking EV than Tesla on the exterior. Only Porsche competes on interior and exterior at 5x the price.
- bmitc 4y agoHave you bot seen what Kia and Hyundai are doing?
- somehnguy 4y agoNot equipping their cars with immobilizers, so anybody with a screwdriver car steal them? I kid, but only sorta. I really liked the Ioniq but seeing that whole mess gives me pause on both Kia and Hyundai.
- parkingrift 4y agoI have. The Kia EV6 has perhaps the most unintuitive capacitive UX in vehicle history. Linus took it for a test drive and legitimately could not figure out how to turn down the AC temperature. Maybe the EV7 won’t be such an abomination. Can’t speak to the Hyundai version. I don’t know much about it other than it seems trivially easy to steal it. Hasn’t made my news radar outside of that.
- atkailash 4y agoThis sounds like they basically want to beta test in real life. I get training models but on a mass scale like this, with lives potentially at stake doesn’t seem right.
- r00tanon 4y agoInteresting that summon and auto park will "not be available and will be restored once vision gets parity with the sensors..." Wow. Wondering when that will happen, as I still get phantom braking in odd situations with my 2022 model 3. Case in point on a freeway straight away with no other vehicles and nothing but grass fields and gray sky. Car suddenly brakes as it tops a gentle hill.
- micheljansen 4y agoGreat, the ultrasonic sensors are about the one thing that works flawlessly on my 2019 Model 3. I hope they don’t get taken away in a future software update like what happened to radar. I bought this car expecting it to get better with every software update. For a while that was true (auto wipers are much better now, though still mediocre). Lately not so much.
- termy 4y agoTechnology will always let you down.
- kkfx 4y agoLadies and gentleman the Real World®©™ i complex... Cam? How much their dinamic range can master direct sunlight, water/snow/something white and big, glass reflections? How about a flying large leaf passing in front of the stereocam? Ultrasound? How do they perform with heavy rain mitigation and environment high background noise? Radar? Same for heavy rain, very little reflective materials etc. Long story short NO SENSOR works well enough in all possible circumstances. That's why the last decision must be human, the human awareness of physical world surrounding can hopefully correct perception errors of sensors and human sense themselves, that's is. So far IMVHO that's the best "tool" we can choose. Normally cars should not run so fast in so tight environment where quickness can't be enough and in general, IME no sensor is really quicker in practice. Doing more? Well than we need to change roads, not cars, and that's HYPER expensive... I mean for instance adding under lanes a small metallic band radars can detect to give something surely and precisely visible by sensors, using some reflective powder in temporary lanes to allow seen them and recognize the different response as "that's the right one, ignore the other", small plastic poles with reflective material aside at regular distance, for the least expensive part. For circulation the sole reliable and potentially affordable is vehicle to vehicle communications meaning every running vehicle emit a beacon any others can detect, parked vehicle can wake up and respond to the beacon as well. That's far from perfect since only new vehicles would have it, but that's also the best solution we have. The beacon beam the size and speed of the vehicle, trajectory analysis is possible. More precise and (far, but not really so far, +300€ per vehicle I think) more expensive adding a small optical gyro to have also the right real direction to compute more precise trajectory can be useful and in that sense FEW beacons on the road itself, activated by passing vehicles can tell the right GPS position to have both more precise navigation allowing an easy local direction (from the gyro) + distance + map to know where we are around 30-50cm precision... All systems are complex but scalable and not so expensive on scale to be doable, the point is if they are worth it or not if we decide to go to a "flying" future for all light vehicles...
- me_me_me 4y ago>That's why the last decision must be human Cant be, its either human driver with assist or full self driving. Sadly due to human nature we cant have both. In studies people who only suppose to assist the driving computer are very easily bored and distracted - non-active driving - making their reaction time sky high (up to 5 seconds). Human drivers need to be actively engaged in process of driving in order to stay alert.
- beej71 4y agoI want my car to be bristling with all kinds of sensors. Especially with FSD. I want it to be superhuman. I don't want it to suck as bad as I do at seeing deer at night. We have the technology.