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Given that you have been complaining about cherrypicking facts/narratives by the other side, you need to acknowledge the fact that you are doing that at this ve

Given that you have been complaining about cherrypicking facts/narratives by the other side, you need to acknowledge the fact that you are doing that at this very moment. You are handwaving away one of the biggest stories in the DOJ's history, a search warrant executed against a former president. We know he has top secret documents, we know they were not declassified, and we know they were held negligently while mixed up with magazines in a comically insecure facility. You have to admit that this is as big if not bigger than "Hunter's laptop", because otherwise all you're really saying is "I want them to talk about MY stories and not THEIRS!"

Alupis 4y ago
> We know he has top secret documents We do. > we know they were not declassified We do not know this, actually. That is literally what is being litigated at this very moment. > and we know they were held negligently while mixed up with magazines in a comically insecure facility We do not know yet if this even matters... > a search warrant executed against a former president Which is extremely shocking and unusual - actually unprecedented. So far the follow-up investigation has been much more lackluster and much less iron-clad as we were initially led to believe. Political hit job? Perhaps. Malfeasance on part of the former President? Perhaps. We don't yet know. Yet, if you've made up your mind already then you've stepped on the land mine set for you by the GP of this particular thread. > You have to admit that this is as big if not bigger than "Hunter's laptop Not even remotely. Hunter's laptop revealed Hunter sold access and influence to the current president, particularly to nations hostile to this country. We also know Joe Biden not only discussed these business dealings with Hunter, but also received a cut of the payments. He is "The Big Guy".
- phailhaus 4y ago
  > We do not know this, actually. We do. Documents are not declassified by merely "thinking about it" like Trump suggested. There is a process, and declassified documents are still classified until they are marked as such. We've seen the pictures, we know they weren't. So yes, it also matters that they were removed from their folders and mixed up haphazardly with no regard to their security. These are all undeniable facts that Trump's own lawyers have failed to dispute. They won't even say if Trump has returned all the documents as he is required under subpoena, or whether Trump actually declassified them. These are all things he could have done immediately if he was innocent. > Not even remotely. Hunter's laptop revealed Hunter sold access and influence to the current president, particularly to nations hostile to this country. Let's use your own attitude against you: where's the official investigation? Do we even know if that's his laptop? Where are the charges? "So far the follow-up investigation has been much more lackluster and much less iron-clad as we were initially led to believe." Namely: nothing. You are not arguing in good faith. You just want your own narratives to win regardless of merit.
  - Alupis 4y ago
    When the dust settles, and Trump still is not in hand cuffs, what will you say then? Start yet another investigation because this time "we've got him!"? We've heard now for 6 years that there's a clear "smoking gun" and we're just days away from indictment. One investigation ends empty-handed, and another just pops up because "reasons". Good thing we're not holding our breath... This classified documents thing is 100% unresolved at the moment. That is a very objective fact, despite what you want to believe. > Let's use your own attitude against you: where's the official investigation? That was the original point. Trap set, and sprung. That story was squashed to shape an election - extremely effectively. If that is not election meddling, I do not know what is. > Do we even know if that's his laptop? They do not even deny it anymore. Plenty of videos of Hunter engaging in illegal activities (which by itself does not implicate the President), plenty of emails, plenty of payments from Chinese organizations and corrupt Ukrainian officials, and even former business partners confirming the validity of the rumors and who the "Big Guy" is. We have none of this from the Trump family, only rumors started by the Clinton campaign that so far, despite unlimited resources, time and efforts plowed into relentless investigation after investigation, have come up dry. But... none of these facts matter apparently, because Trump isn't on your team. That was the point the GP post made.

Alupis 4y ago

> We know he has top secret documents We do. > we know they were not declassified We do not know this, actually. That is literally what is being litigated at this very moment. > and we know they were held negligently while mixed up with magazines in a comically insecure facility We do not know yet if this even matters... > a search warrant executed against a former president Which is extremely shocking and unusual - actually unprecedented. So far the follow-up investigation has been much more lackluster and much less iron-clad as we were initially led to believe. Political hit job? Perhaps. Malfeasance on part of the former President? Perhaps. We don't yet know. Yet, if you've made up your mind already then you've stepped on the land mine set for you by the GP of this particular thread. > You have to admit that this is as big if not bigger than "Hunter's laptop Not even remotely. Hunter's laptop revealed Hunter sold access and influence to the current president, particularly to nations hostile to this country. We also know Joe Biden not only discussed these business dealings with Hunter, but also received a cut of the payments. He is "The Big Guy".

phailhaus 4y ago
> We do not know this, actually. We do. Documents are not declassified by merely "thinking about it" like Trump suggested. There is a process, and declassified documents are still classified until they are marked as such. We've seen the pictures, we know they weren't. So yes, it also matters that they were removed from their folders and mixed up haphazardly with no regard to their security. These are all undeniable facts that Trump's own lawyers have failed to dispute. They won't even say if Trump has returned all the documents as he is required under subpoena, or whether Trump actually declassified them. These are all things he could have done immediately if he was innocent. > Not even remotely. Hunter's laptop revealed Hunter sold access and influence to the current president, particularly to nations hostile to this country. Let's use your own attitude against you: where's the official investigation? Do we even know if that's his laptop? Where are the charges? "So far the follow-up investigation has been much more lackluster and much less iron-clad as we were initially led to believe." Namely: nothing. You are not arguing in good faith. You just want your own narratives to win regardless of merit.
- Alupis 4y ago
  When the dust settles, and Trump still is not in hand cuffs, what will you say then? Start yet another investigation because this time "we've got him!"? We've heard now for 6 years that there's a clear "smoking gun" and we're just days away from indictment. One investigation ends empty-handed, and another just pops up because "reasons". Good thing we're not holding our breath... This classified documents thing is 100% unresolved at the moment. That is a very objective fact, despite what you want to believe. > Let's use your own attitude against you: where's the official investigation? That was the original point. Trap set, and sprung. That story was squashed to shape an election - extremely effectively. If that is not election meddling, I do not know what is. > Do we even know if that's his laptop? They do not even deny it anymore. Plenty of videos of Hunter engaging in illegal activities (which by itself does not implicate the President), plenty of emails, plenty of payments from Chinese organizations and corrupt Ukrainian officials, and even former business partners confirming the validity of the rumors and who the "Big Guy" is. We have none of this from the Trump family, only rumors started by the Clinton campaign that so far, despite unlimited resources, time and efforts plowed into relentless investigation after investigation, have come up dry. But... none of these facts matter apparently, because Trump isn't on your team. That was the point the GP post made.