3 ms·

Capitalists are liberals, but there might be truth to what you said.

rayiner 4y ago
But they’re not “hippie liberals.” Oregonians are probably the most anti-capitalist and anti-industry (really, anti-economy) people in the country.
- Kye 4y ago
  I think this gets closer to the point I tried to make. There is no unified "blue" or "red," so there wouldn't be a split along the colors cable news paints on election maps. Our FPTP system papers over a lot of diversity of thought that gets wrapped up under the big tents, but doesn't match geography. There are tankies in conservative-run states and evangelicals in Blue Country. Any attempt to split the country along ideological lines would make the most ridiculous gerrymandered district blush.
  - rayiner 4y ago
    I think you're mixing up different things. You're correct that teams "blue" and "red" are actually coalitions of people who believe quite different things. But in part that's because of geographic and cultural commonalities that cut across party lines. Both Oregon Democrats and Oregon Republicans skew libertarian, because the state does. In Georgia, both Democrats and Republicans skew more religious. A lot of the intractability of our national politics is because geographical and cultural differences are overlaid on top of normal political differences. Splitting the country up along geographic lines would allow us to just fight over politics, instead of over deep-rooted cultural patterns.
    - Kye 4y ago
      That's an easier position to take if you aren't one of the people who'd suffer worse religious persecution in a state unconstrained by the constitution. I would still be fighting against those deep-rooted cultural patterns, but I would be overrun quickly without support from enforcement of the 1st and 14th Amendments. State equivalents would be quickly discarded.
      - rayiner 4y ago
        44% of the people in my home country think I should be executed due to my religious beliefs: https://assets.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/11/2013/04/gsi2-chp1-9.png https://assets.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/11/2.... But that's what their religion says and it is what it is. It would be wrong for someone else to come along and impose their own cultural patterns (such as secularism) for the sake of a minority. That's just imperialism.

But they’re not “hippie liberals.” Oregonians are probably the most anti-capitalist and anti-industry (really, anti-economy) people in the country.

Kye 4y ago
I think this gets closer to the point I tried to make. There is no unified "blue" or "red," so there wouldn't be a split along the colors cable news paints on election maps. Our FPTP system papers over a lot of diversity of thought that gets wrapped up under the big tents, but doesn't match geography. There are tankies in conservative-run states and evangelicals in Blue Country. Any attempt to split the country along ideological lines would make the most ridiculous gerrymandered district blush.
- rayiner 4y ago
  I think you're mixing up different things. You're correct that teams "blue" and "red" are actually coalitions of people who believe quite different things. But in part that's because of geographic and cultural commonalities that cut across party lines. Both Oregon Democrats and Oregon Republicans skew libertarian, because the state does. In Georgia, both Democrats and Republicans skew more religious. A lot of the intractability of our national politics is because geographical and cultural differences are overlaid on top of normal political differences. Splitting the country up along geographic lines would allow us to just fight over politics, instead of over deep-rooted cultural patterns.
  - Kye 4y ago
    That's an easier position to take if you aren't one of the people who'd suffer worse religious persecution in a state unconstrained by the constitution. I would still be fighting against those deep-rooted cultural patterns, but I would be overrun quickly without support from enforcement of the 1st and 14th Amendments. State equivalents would be quickly discarded.
    - rayiner 4y ago
      44% of the people in my home country think I should be executed due to my religious beliefs: https://assets.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/11/2013/04/gsi2-chp1-9.png https://assets.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/11/2.... But that's what their religion says and it is what it is. It would be wrong for someone else to come along and impose their own cultural patterns (such as secularism) for the sake of a minority. That's just imperialism.