4 ms·

Finally the person has been charged that I can speak plainly about these things - elections in 2012 and 2016 had incredible amounts of fraud at the local level.

Finally the person has been charged that I can speak plainly about these things - elections in 2012 and 2016 had incredible amounts of fraud at the local level. These elections mean next to nothing politically for the local folks running, however, the state and national level really “appreciate” the ability of single upstarts to “get out the vote” in their party. No true preferences for government by the governed have been revealed through elections for some time. That is the travesty for the US, and will be its ultimate downfall

chasil 4y ago
Unfortunately, the fraud is hardly new. Nixon did not lose to Kennedy as meekly as some assert, despite some evidence of fraud in Illinois: https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/the-drama-behind-president-kennedys-1960-election-win/ https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/the-drama-behind-preside... It would have been far better for the country if Kennedy had lost (to say nothing of Kennedy himself). Let's go back further: https://guides.loc.gov/chronicling-america-1884-presidential-election https://guides.loc.gov/chronicling-america-1884-presidential... Election fraud has a long history in the United States. It must end.
devwastaken 4y ago
I am actually very interested in evidence of election fraud. The "there's no fraud" claims sound like hand waving. Of course there's fraud, but to what extent, and how do we know that extent?
- chasil 4y ago
  Here is some hard evidence of how elections are defrauded in the United States. https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud https://www.heritage.org/election-integrity/commentary/add-these-voter-fraud-cases-the-growing-list https://www.heritage.org/election-integrity/commentary/add-t... This is a conservative-leaning site. I would be curious if a liberal site had opposing evidence.
  - kube-system 4y ago
    These are in the news all the time. They’re almost all crazy idiots who show up to the polls and pretend to be their dead relative. Add them all up and they don’t amount to a difference in anything anyway.
    - chasil 4y ago
      All of these little differences are exploited to become a tsunami. Trump went to bed on election night assured that he had won. I was no supporter of Trump, but I regret his passing in what has come. We need accurate and transparent elections, full stop. 'The U.S. Supreme Court said in 2008 in Crawford v. Marion County Election Board, “flagrant examples of such fraud … have been documented throughout this Nation's history by respected historians and journalists … [that] demonstrate that not only is the risk of voter fraud real but that it could affect the outcome of a close election.”'
      - kube-system 4y ago
        > Trump went to bed on election night assured that he had won. This was painfully predictable. More conservative demographics preferred voting in person. Their votes were counted first, electronically. Paper mail in ballots were counted afterwards in many places. I agree that we need accurate elections, but even if the link above only represents 1% of actual fraud, that still doesn’t amount to enough to change any elections.
        water8 4y ago
        Mail voting is not secure and you’re not being honest if you say it is. you’re also not being honest, if you conflate absentee with mail voting, where the stark difference is that one is requested in the other one is disseminated en mass. Also states like California require a new voter ID to confirm who you are so yeah, you can vote as your relative who has dementia and doesn’t show up. people act like cheating in elections pretty hard it’s actually pretty simple. It just requires organization do it at a large scale.

chasil 4y ago

Unfortunately, the fraud is hardly new. Nixon did not lose to Kennedy as meekly as some assert, despite some evidence of fraud in Illinois: https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/the-drama-behind-president-kennedys-1960-election-win/ https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/the-drama-behind-preside... It would have been far better for the country if Kennedy had lost (to say nothing of Kennedy himself). Let's go back further: https://guides.loc.gov/chronicling-america-1884-presidential-election https://guides.loc.gov/chronicling-america-1884-presidential... Election fraud has a long history in the United States. It must end.

devwastaken 4y ago

I am actually very interested in evidence of election fraud. The "there's no fraud" claims sound like hand waving. Of course there's fraud, but to what extent, and how do we know that extent?

chasil 4y ago
Here is some hard evidence of how elections are defrauded in the United States. https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud https://www.heritage.org/voterfraud https://www.heritage.org/election-integrity/commentary/add-these-voter-fraud-cases-the-growing-list https://www.heritage.org/election-integrity/commentary/add-t... This is a conservative-leaning site. I would be curious if a liberal site had opposing evidence.
- kube-system 4y ago
  These are in the news all the time. They’re almost all crazy idiots who show up to the polls and pretend to be their dead relative. Add them all up and they don’t amount to a difference in anything anyway.
  - chasil 4y ago
    All of these little differences are exploited to become a tsunami. Trump went to bed on election night assured that he had won. I was no supporter of Trump, but I regret his passing in what has come. We need accurate and transparent elections, full stop. 'The U.S. Supreme Court said in 2008 in Crawford v. Marion County Election Board, “flagrant examples of such fraud … have been documented throughout this Nation's history by respected historians and journalists … [that] demonstrate that not only is the risk of voter fraud real but that it could affect the outcome of a close election.”'
    - kube-system 4y ago
      > Trump went to bed on election night assured that he had won. This was painfully predictable. More conservative demographics preferred voting in person. Their votes were counted first, electronically. Paper mail in ballots were counted afterwards in many places. I agree that we need accurate elections, but even if the link above only represents 1% of actual fraud, that still doesn’t amount to enough to change any elections.
      - water8 4y ago
        Mail voting is not secure and you’re not being honest if you say it is. you’re also not being honest, if you conflate absentee with mail voting, where the stark difference is that one is requested in the other one is disseminated en mass. Also states like California require a new voter ID to confirm who you are so yeah, you can vote as your relative who has dementia and doesn’t show up. people act like cheating in elections pretty hard it’s actually pretty simple. It just requires organization do it at a large scale.