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The NYT might need to update their article from yesterday. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/10/03/technology/konnech-election-conspiracy-theories.html https://www.

by eej71 4y ago

The NYT might need to update their article from yesterday. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/10/03/technology/konnech-election-conspiracy-theories.html https://www.nytimes.com/2022/10/03/technology/konnech-electi...

ceejayoz 4y ago
They did. > Update, Oct. 5: After this article was published, the chief executive of Konnech was arrested on suspicion of theft of personal information about poll workers.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- hn_throwaway_99 4y ago
  That is the most bullshit "update" I have ever seen. NYT shouldn't just "update" that article, they should issue a retraction and a major apology, and fire people involved with the story. Maybe if the update had said this I'd be OK with it: > Update, Oct. 5: After this article was published, the chief executive of Konnech was arrested on suspicion of theft of personal information about poll workers. Prosecutors asserted that the chief executive had poll worker information stored on servers in the People's Republic of China, which in our original article we disparaged as an "unfounded conspiracy theory", and the statement in our article, "It said that all the data for its American customers were stored on servers in the United States and that it had no ties to the Chinese government." is likely totally false.
  - pnf 4y ago
    Why would they fire anyone? These aren't mistakes.
    - the_optimist 4y ago
      It is a mistake. They’re supposed to use article structure, careful language, selective statements, hidden sources, and unfounded suasion to hide misinformation and hackery.
  - adamrezich 4y ago
  - Wowfunhappy 4y ago
    What does the theft of personal data have to do with claims of widespread voter fraud?
    - anon291 4y ago
      In the article, the right-leaning groups (that the Times called 'election deniers', despite not offering evidence) claimed the company stored data in China. That is likely true. Or at least it's true enough that a judge issued a warrant. Nothing in the article says these groups are claiming this company participated in fraud. Only that they are stealing american data. The article lays out exactly what True the Vote claimed: > Ms. Engelbrecht and Mr. Phillips claimed at the conference and in livestreams that they investigated Konnech in early 2021. Eventually, they said, the group’s team gained access to Konnech’s database by guessing the password, which was “password,” according to the online accounts from people who attended the conference. Once inside, they told attendees, the team downloaded personal information on about 1.8 million poll workers. Based on the case notes, I think this allegation is merited and not a conspiracy theory at all.
      - bandushrew 4y ago
        1.8 million poll workers sounds like a huge number, how many poll workers were there in the US last election?
        anon291 4y ago
        This is attacking them on a small part of the allegation. The allegation the NYT claimed is a conspiracy is that the data were stored in China. If the NYT had an article on how they overstated how many poll workers data were stored, that may be a fairer critique, but one that wouldn't make such a sensational headline.
thepasswordis 4y ago
>Using threadbare evidence, or none at all, the group suggested that a small American election software company, Konnech, had secret ties to the Chinese Communist Party and had given the Chinese government backdoor access to personal data about two million poll workers in the United States, according to online accounts from several people at the conference. Unreal that they published this.
- tootie 4y ago
  > In the ensuing weeks, the conspiracy theory grew as it shot around the internet. To believers, the claims showed how China had gained near complete control of America’s elections. That part is still valid. And really we don't actually know what evidence the DA has or if the scope of the arrest warrant matches the theory. All they've said is that some data was stored in China.
  - hn_throwaway_99 4y ago
    > All they've said is that some data was stored in China. To be clear, "having data stored in China" is exactly equivalent to "had given the Chinese government backdoor access to personal data" - and that's not some "conspiracy", that's the stated law of China. Furthermore, the reason that's so important is because "having some data stored in China", if true, means that this quote from the article, "Konnech said none of the accusations were true. It said that all the data for its American customers were stored on servers in the United States and that it had no ties to the Chinese government." would be a complete lie.
    - tarakat 4y ago
      Reading that statement by Konnech, I am struck how brazen the NYT was. Given two opposing statements, they simply decided which one debunks the other, and passed it off as fact. I wonder how many other instances of this there are in their other reporting, where reasonable accusations or suspicions are "debunked" simply by the accused stating "nu-uh".
      - 4y ago
pyuser583 4y ago
Ouch. I take a perverse pleasure when journalists screw up, but this is bad.
puffoflogic 4y ago
They probably rushed that article out the door precisely to ensure a more favorable narrative was established before new facts dropped.

by eej71 4y ago

ceejayoz 4y ago

They did. > Update, Oct. 5: After this article was published, the chief executive of Konnech was arrested on suspicion of theft of personal information about poll workers.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
hn_throwaway_99 4y ago
That is the most bullshit "update" I have ever seen. NYT shouldn't just "update" that article, they should issue a retraction and a major apology, and fire people involved with the story. Maybe if the update had said this I'd be OK with it: > Update, Oct. 5: After this article was published, the chief executive of Konnech was arrested on suspicion of theft of personal information about poll workers. Prosecutors asserted that the chief executive had poll worker information stored on servers in the People's Republic of China, which in our original article we disparaged as an "unfounded conspiracy theory", and the statement in our article, "It said that all the data for its American customers were stored on servers in the United States and that it had no ties to the Chinese government." is likely totally false.
- pnf 4y ago
  Why would they fire anyone? These aren't mistakes.
  - the_optimist 4y ago
    It is a mistake. They’re supposed to use article structure, careful language, selective statements, hidden sources, and unfounded suasion to hide misinformation and hackery.
- adamrezich 4y ago
- Wowfunhappy 4y ago
  What does the theft of personal data have to do with claims of widespread voter fraud?
  - anon291 4y ago
    In the article, the right-leaning groups (that the Times called 'election deniers', despite not offering evidence) claimed the company stored data in China. That is likely true. Or at least it's true enough that a judge issued a warrant. Nothing in the article says these groups are claiming this company participated in fraud. Only that they are stealing american data. The article lays out exactly what True the Vote claimed: > Ms. Engelbrecht and Mr. Phillips claimed at the conference and in livestreams that they investigated Konnech in early 2021. Eventually, they said, the group’s team gained access to Konnech’s database by guessing the password, which was “password,” according to the online accounts from people who attended the conference. Once inside, they told attendees, the team downloaded personal information on about 1.8 million poll workers. Based on the case notes, I think this allegation is merited and not a conspiracy theory at all.
    - bandushrew 4y ago
      1.8 million poll workers sounds like a huge number, how many poll workers were there in the US last election?
      - anon291 4y ago
        This is attacking them on a small part of the allegation. The allegation the NYT claimed is a conspiracy is that the data were stored in China. If the NYT had an article on how they overstated how many poll workers data were stored, that may be a fairer critique, but one that wouldn't make such a sensational headline.

thepasswordis 4y ago

>Using threadbare evidence, or none at all, the group suggested that a small American election software company, Konnech, had secret ties to the Chinese Communist Party and had given the Chinese government backdoor access to personal data about two million poll workers in the United States, according to online accounts from several people at the conference. Unreal that they published this.

tootie 4y ago
> In the ensuing weeks, the conspiracy theory grew as it shot around the internet. To believers, the claims showed how China had gained near complete control of America’s elections. That part is still valid. And really we don't actually know what evidence the DA has or if the scope of the arrest warrant matches the theory. All they've said is that some data was stored in China.
- hn_throwaway_99 4y ago
  > All they've said is that some data was stored in China. To be clear, "having data stored in China" is exactly equivalent to "had given the Chinese government backdoor access to personal data" - and that's not some "conspiracy", that's the stated law of China. Furthermore, the reason that's so important is because "having some data stored in China", if true, means that this quote from the article, "Konnech said none of the accusations were true. It said that all the data for its American customers were stored on servers in the United States and that it had no ties to the Chinese government." would be a complete lie.
  - tarakat 4y ago
    Reading that statement by Konnech, I am struck how brazen the NYT was. Given two opposing statements, they simply decided which one debunks the other, and passed it off as fact. I wonder how many other instances of this there are in their other reporting, where reasonable accusations or suspicions are "debunked" simply by the accused stating "nu-uh".
    - 4y ago

pyuser583 4y ago

Ouch. I take a perverse pleasure when journalists screw up, but this is bad.

puffoflogic 4y ago

They probably rushed that article out the door precisely to ensure a more favorable narrative was established before new facts dropped.