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> Is this a value judgement ... sounds like negative framing at least. Yes it is a negative value judgement. I am not trolling or being unnecessarily provocati

> Is this a value judgement ... sounds like negative framing at least. Yes it is a negative value judgement. I am not trolling or being unnecessarily provocative. I think that, on balance, some technologies are likely to make things worse. Not in general, but to specifically counter the very aim they set out to solve. > the human weakness, insecurity and disconnection is already there I disagree with this. On several levels. Some people have different abilities and personality for sure. But the insecurity and weakness I speak of is societal (weak interpersonal relations in a single-serving microwave meal culture), and is caused by precisely such disconnecting technologies. This kind of technology creates less incentives to develop human interpersonal skills and ultimately saps confidence. The user learns to simulate confidence. > I think it's good to be skeptical of instances of this kind of work in terms of the details like how it respects the users privacy and treats their data sensitively, and whether or not it's selling an effective method, I think it's important to be sceptical generally. That makes one a good technologist and not merely an implementor of random ideas that we do "because we can". All the things you mention are hot topics, and I agree they need scrutiny. But there are wider and more complex factors to remain sceptical of, such as the social impact of technologies. > but at least it's sort of aimed towards good. I have great faith and optimism in human beings, these things are always "aimed toward good". I make no judgements about the motives of the developers (which I think is already a few steps more charitable than some of the insinuations I've seen in comments). I'm getting down-voted because I dare to commit a heresy of asking deeper questions. > Also ad tech is the epitome of AI applications that ride on human weakness ;) That's true.

mkmk3 4y ago
I think I understand where you're coming from, and largely agree. Regarding societal weakness/insecurity stemming from disconnecting technologies, I view that as something that's happened to a large degree, and it shapes chunks of the modern landscape as I see it. Technologies that help to correct that are valuable. Dependencies on others force the development of interpersonal skills, and maybe something like this discourages someone from joining an association like toastmasters or similar. That would be a shame. But on the other hand, depending on the users own flavor of neuroses it may help them feel comfortable enough or develop the interest to prompt them to do something more social. I really don't know, I could see it nudging my past selves either way. Regardless, thanks for your response. I did need a reminder to take a wider perspective in this context, I appreciate it.
- nonrandomstring 4y ago
  Thanks for the exchange. > depending on the users own flavor of neuroses it may help them feel comfortable enough or develop the interest to prompt them to do something more social. Absolutely. I agree this is real utility. I guess I'm concerned that these are actually outliers used to justify a more troubling project. And maybe more people have crippling anxiety disorders only treatable by machines than I care to admit. It actually reminds me of the arguments around anti-depressants as a gateway to proper therapy. I do hear you.

mkmk3 4y ago

I think I understand where you're coming from, and largely agree. Regarding societal weakness/insecurity stemming from disconnecting technologies, I view that as something that's happened to a large degree, and it shapes chunks of the modern landscape as I see it. Technologies that help to correct that are valuable. Dependencies on others force the development of interpersonal skills, and maybe something like this discourages someone from joining an association like toastmasters or similar. That would be a shame. But on the other hand, depending on the users own flavor of neuroses it may help them feel comfortable enough or develop the interest to prompt them to do something more social. I really don't know, I could see it nudging my past selves either way. Regardless, thanks for your response. I did need a reminder to take a wider perspective in this context, I appreciate it.

nonrandomstring 4y ago
Thanks for the exchange. > depending on the users own flavor of neuroses it may help them feel comfortable enough or develop the interest to prompt them to do something more social. Absolutely. I agree this is real utility. I guess I'm concerned that these are actually outliers used to justify a more troubling project. And maybe more people have crippling anxiety disorders only treatable by machines than I care to admit. It actually reminds me of the arguments around anti-depressants as a gateway to proper therapy. I do hear you.