4 ms·

Right? I completely didn't understand this part? In pretty much everything else, you cheat, you're basically done.

by jrm4 4y ago

jayski 4y ago
I'm not a fan of this player, I don't even play chess. Still it sounds a bit harsh to me that a child that cheated online can never in his adult life participate in chess tournaments. If he had cheated as an adult I would have a different opinion.
- fredoliveira 4y ago
  Well, that's where the report comes in. He has cheated several times as an adult too.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - smaryjerry 4y ago
    If you consider 17 an adult and that the report is correctly identifying those games. This is no different than cheating in a video game online. It’s playing random people from matchmaking for rating points tied to that game. Maybe there were multiple tournaments as well for small prizes (probably under $1000 prize money) if the report on the report is correct though. I’d compare it to an NBA player cheating in a pick up game of basketball.
    - selfmodruntime 4y ago
      > If you consider 17 an adult and that the report is correctly identifying those games For him, that was 2 years ago.
- kcplate 4y ago
  His past cheating AND the statistical anomalies related to his fast progress may also be explained by cheating in an Occam’s Razor sort of way is what is raising the flags. I don’t care one way or the other, but I’d assume the worst.
- Taek 4y ago
  He's still a child. He cheated when he was 16 (now we have evidence that he cheated at 17 too), and he's only 19. I don't think a 5 year ban (or honestly, even a 10 year ban) is all that extreme.
Bud 4y ago
Oh. Really? I mean, not in baseball. Not in football. Not in basketball. Not even in President of the United States. What is this alternate reality you're in, and what is your list of "everything else"? Citations, please.
- jrm4 4y ago
  I didn't go deep on it, but it seemed like dude's cheating was repeated, open, and notorious.
  - Bud 4y ago
    It was. I was addressing the other part of your statement, however.
- Cupertino95014 4y ago
  Citation: Pete Rose, Sammy Sosa, Mark McGwire, Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, and Curt Schilling will never get in the Hall of Fame. You're right that that's not "basically done," but once they're retired, HoF is all they have to look forward to. Being officially in disgrace is pretty done.
  - Bud 4y ago
    Yet I can cite hundreds of cases of cheating in all the major sports in which, yes, there was a suspension or other penalty, but the players or people involved were then allowed to participate again. The examples you cited are very extreme, but even in these cases, they don't support your argument. None of those players were removed from the game during their playing careers and barred. And again, those are just the most extreme cases. There are many, many less severe cases, all of which support my argument and not yours. You might want to remove Schilling from your list, btw. He hasn't been accused of any cheating; instead, he did other embarrassing things.
    - Cupertino95014 4y ago
      If you read what I said, I didn't claim PED violators are removed from the sport. I said that being denied HoF is not just a slap on the wrist. If you're not someone who'd be considered HoF material anyway, then the consequences are probably manageable.
paxys 4y ago
> In pretty much everything else, you cheat, you're basically done. The penalty for cheating in most major sports is way more lenient than you think. Most leagues will suspend you for a handful of games in the first instance. In the NBA for example you can be caught three times before being suspended for one season.
- lamontcg 4y ago
  MLS you catch a 10 game ban (out of a 34 game season) for your first PED offense.
- smeagull 4y ago
  Yeah, and you can even just go into a different sport like Baseball for that time.
  - jprd 4y ago
    /orsonwellesclap This is a super on-point and sharp critique based on the assertion that Michael Jordan's first retirement from the NBA to go play Minor League baseball was an under-the-table suspension for gambling on NBA games (dude has a legit problem) while playing in the NBA Championships. This happened right after a three-peat (3 Championships in a row). And in one fell marketing miracle, the status quo and marketability of both the NBA and Michael Jordan was protected. One and a half years later, MJ "un-retired" to light up the league for another 3 straight championships.
mensetmanusman 4y ago
I can see both sides. If you have to cheat, that is your personal flaw and you have many other options in life where that behavior doesn’t matter. Especially since there are many others who don’t cheat that can take your place in a competition.

Right? I completely didn't understand this part? In pretty much everything else, you cheat, you're basically done.

by jrm4 4y ago

Right? I completely didn't understand this part? In pretty much everything else, you cheat, you're basically done.

I'm not a fan of this player, I don't even play chess. Still it sounds a bit harsh to me that a child that cheated online can never in his adult life participate in chess tournaments. If he had cheated as an adult I would have a different opinion.

fredoliveira 4y ago
Well, that's where the report comes in. He has cheated several times as an adult too.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- smaryjerry 4y ago
  If you consider 17 an adult and that the report is correctly identifying those games. This is no different than cheating in a video game online. It’s playing random people from matchmaking for rating points tied to that game. Maybe there were multiple tournaments as well for small prizes (probably under $1000 prize money) if the report on the report is correct though. I’d compare it to an NBA player cheating in a pick up game of basketball.
  - selfmodruntime 4y ago
    > If you consider 17 an adult and that the report is correctly identifying those games For him, that was 2 years ago.
kcplate 4y ago
His past cheating AND the statistical anomalies related to his fast progress may also be explained by cheating in an Occam’s Razor sort of way is what is raising the flags. I don’t care one way or the other, but I’d assume the worst.
Taek 4y ago
He's still a child. He cheated when he was 16 (now we have evidence that he cheated at 17 too), and he's only 19. I don't think a 5 year ban (or honestly, even a 10 year ban) is all that extreme.

Bud 4y ago

Oh. Really? I mean, not in baseball. Not in football. Not in basketball. Not even in President of the United States. What is this alternate reality you're in, and what is your list of "everything else"? Citations, please.

jrm4 4y ago
I didn't go deep on it, but it seemed like dude's cheating was repeated, open, and notorious.
- Bud 4y ago
  It was. I was addressing the other part of your statement, however.
Cupertino95014 4y ago
Citation: Pete Rose, Sammy Sosa, Mark McGwire, Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, and Curt Schilling will never get in the Hall of Fame. You're right that that's not "basically done," but once they're retired, HoF is all they have to look forward to. Being officially in disgrace is pretty done.
- Bud 4y ago
  Yet I can cite hundreds of cases of cheating in all the major sports in which, yes, there was a suspension or other penalty, but the players or people involved were then allowed to participate again. The examples you cited are very extreme, but even in these cases, they don't support your argument. None of those players were removed from the game during their playing careers and barred. And again, those are just the most extreme cases. There are many, many less severe cases, all of which support my argument and not yours. You might want to remove Schilling from your list, btw. He hasn't been accused of any cheating; instead, he did other embarrassing things.
  - Cupertino95014 4y ago
    If you read what I said, I didn't claim PED violators are removed from the sport. I said that being denied HoF is not just a slap on the wrist. If you're not someone who'd be considered HoF material anyway, then the consequences are probably manageable.

paxys 4y ago

> In pretty much everything else, you cheat, you're basically done. The penalty for cheating in most major sports is way more lenient than you think. Most leagues will suspend you for a handful of games in the first instance. In the NBA for example you can be caught three times before being suspended for one season.

lamontcg 4y ago
MLS you catch a 10 game ban (out of a 34 game season) for your first PED offense.
smeagull 4y ago
Yeah, and you can even just go into a different sport like Baseball for that time.
- jprd 4y ago
  /orsonwellesclap This is a super on-point and sharp critique based on the assertion that Michael Jordan's first retirement from the NBA to go play Minor League baseball was an under-the-table suspension for gambling on NBA games (dude has a legit problem) while playing in the NBA Championships. This happened right after a three-peat (3 Championships in a row). And in one fell marketing miracle, the status quo and marketability of both the NBA and Michael Jordan was protected. One and a half years later, MJ "un-retired" to light up the league for another 3 straight championships.

mensetmanusman 4y ago

I can see both sides. If you have to cheat, that is your personal flaw and you have many other options in life where that behavior doesn’t matter. Especially since there are many others who don’t cheat that can take your place in a competition.