7 ms·

The author should have defined the term "schizoid" since it colloquially refers to Schizophrenia rather than Schizoid Personality Disorder. The former involves

by sxp 4y ago

The author should have defined the term "schizoid" since it colloquially refers to Schizophrenia rather than Schizoid Personality Disorder. The former involves hallucinations and is also a pejorative used to imply that someone is "crazy". The latter is an extreme form of introversion: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorder https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizoid_personality_disorder DSM-5 criteria: - Neither desires nor enjoys close relationships, including being part of a family. - Almost always chooses solitary activities. - Has little, if any, interest in having sexual experiences with another person. - Takes pleasure in few, if any, activities. - Lacks close friends or confidants other than first-degree relatives. - Appears indifferent to the praise or criticism of others. - Shows emotional coldness, detachment, or flattened affectivity.

PuppyTailWags 4y ago
Schizophrenia also has disaffected response and reduced emotional affect, btw. Folks who have schizophrenia sometimes considers this more debilitating than hallucinations, because they don't respond to antipsychotics.
kyleyeats 4y ago
If you're uncomfortable with the term 'schizoid,' you can try medicating the heck out of it and calling it ADHD.
- Cornelius267 4y ago
  These are different things. They may share some overlapping symptoms, perhaps even some similar brain changes, but the internal phenomenology of them are quite different. They are not exclusive, but nor are they the same thing.
  - kyleyeats 4y ago
    No, they're just different words and different times. Schizoids have a false mask they use to interact with others. If we could have, we would have medicated them back then so that they're always presenting with the false mask instead of their "wrong" asocial presentation. That's what ADHD is. We didn't suddenly stop having schizoids and start having a bunch of ADHD people.
    - Cornelius267 4y ago
      No, they are different things. I am honestly quite confused as to how you could think that they were the same thing. They both exist as a constellation of separate diagnostic criteria, for example, and the internal phenomenology of both is different. You can have one, but not the other, or you could have both. For example, here's a quora where someone with both talks about it: https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-ADHD-and-schizoid-personality-disorder-I-have-been-diagnosed-ADHD-and-only-recently-discovered-SPD-however-I-feel-I-strongly-identify-with-both https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-ADHD-an... Or if you prefer a more 'scientific' source, here's one examining the comorbidity of ADHD and certain disorders, among which Schizoid Personality Disorder is one: https://www.elsevier.es/en-revista-revista-psiquiatria-salud-mental-486-articulo-comorbidity-personality-disorders-attention-deficit-hyperactivity-S217350501830030X https://www.elsevier.es/en-revista-revista-psiquiatria-salud... They find a correlation, yes, but they are certainly not one and the same.
      - kyleyeats 4y ago
        I mean, do you think ADHD is new? Did it just not exist before 1990 or whenever it was made up? Do you think any medical condition before then covers what ADHD is/was? Lance Armstrong when he is biking and Lance Armstrong when he is recovering are not the same either. But Lance can take drugs to get more of the biking time and less of the recovering time. This is how SPD and ADHD work. ADHD is just a medicated false mask that a schizoid person can maintain for longer periods of time than usual, without episodes of hermitude to recharge. They're doping. Failure to maintain the mask looks like a breakdown in attention/focus. People do long, focused work because of the expectations of others. Schizoids don't experience that, but instead basically run on obsession. They stop working when that fizzles out. On pills, though, they can work forever. The 'scientific' people serve the people making the pills and nobody else. They rename everything every few years to sell more pills. If you want a proper take on SPD, look up Millon and his subtypes. Most of the "knowledge" of conditions in the zeitgeist comes from prescription drug commercials.
        intelVISA 4y ago
- hosh 4y ago
  SPD shares more similarities to Narcissitic Personality Disorder than it does with ADHD -- not in terms of effect and imposition on other people, but rather in the lived experience of self and other, self and world. I don't think SPD (or NPD) are something you can medicate.
  - plutonorm 4y ago
    Perhaps long acting oxytocin.
    - hosh 4y ago
      If we're going that route, I think it's more likely we'll see clinical outcomes with therupeutic use of psilosybin or MDMA. I don't think it is so much that the brain needs to be tweaked, but that experiencing self, other, and world in a different ways can transform those in a way that does not require ongoing medication.
  - kyleyeats 4y ago
    They're also kinda opposites. The cure for NPD is isolation and the cure for SPD is being around people (agreed-- neither are in pill form yet). They both have immutable internal status, but the narcissist's is very low while the schizoid's is very high. The best example IMO of a cured narcissist is Larry Lawton, who faced a long period of isolation in prison. He's on Youtube.
rnxrx 4y ago
The dilemma with these sorts of discussions always seems to come back to where the line is drawn between the personality and the disorder. Clearly there are some pathologies whose features manifest in ways that are dangerous (..to one's self and/or others) but it's not clear to me which of the criteria above rise from being facets of ordinary personalities and become truly pathological. This seems to also coincide with other literature that describes those with SPD as being among the least likely to seek treatment.
wooque 4y ago
That sounds like advanced depression
- uoaei 4y ago
  I see it as "depression with an onset in early life, probably from neglectful parenting".
  - agumonkey 4y ago
    pardon me for bringing the lineage argument, very often a neglecting person was neglected.. so on and so forth
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
elliotec 4y ago
The author did not need to define schizoid because: 1. It is their blog, and they probably assume their audience is educated in what schizoid means or is capable of looking it up. 2. Schizoid does not colloquially refer to schizophrenia, and schizophrenia is not a pejorative for "crazy," these are both real and distinct (but related) disorders that do not require anyone talking about them to dichotomize them from what you might assume people misconstrue their false definitions as. Also, it's not an "extreme form of introversion" - it's much more than that, and putting it that way minimizes the serious nature of the disorder.
- belkarx 4y ago
  You're incorrect on point 2. In many communities, schizoid/schizo does refer in a derogatory/shorthand manner to schizophrenia and many more people are familiar with schizophrenia than schizoid disorder, so that is more likely to be the immediate assumption.
- MichaelCollins 4y ago
  > 2. Schizoid does not colloquially refer to schizophrenia It often does colloquially refer to schizophrenia, I've heard people use the word this way for as long as I can remember. General purpose English dictionaries document this colloquial meaning, I checked several to be sure: "(archaic) schizophrenic" https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/schizoid https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/schizoid "characterized by, resulting from, tending toward, or suggestive of schizophrenia" https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/schizoid https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/schizoid "suffering from or behaving as if suffering from schizophrenia" https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/schizoid https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/schizoid "Informal. of or relating to schizophrenia or to multiple personality." https://www.dictionary.com/browse/schizoid https://www.dictionary.com/browse/schizoid "Someone who is schizoid has schizophrenia" https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/schizoid https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/schizoi...
lofatdairy 4y ago
I assumed that it was a reference to D&G's Anti-Oedipus, that definition seems to make a bit more sense.
anvic 4y ago
Schizoid doesn't colloquially refer to schizophrenia.
- richbell 4y ago
  It kind of does, even if mistakenly. People use "schizo" as a derogatory way to refer to schizophrenic and "schizoid" isn't a commonly used term; I have seen people use it this way.
agumonkey 4y ago
The sexuality part is interesting to me, because gross biomechanics aside, it's one intense merging with someone else emotions. I'd be very happy to find places or people to discuss the neuropsy or neurobiology of this.
openfuture 4y ago
Sounds like someone who has been betrayed one to many times.

by sxp 4y ago

PuppyTailWags 4y ago

Schizophrenia also has disaffected response and reduced emotional affect, btw. Folks who have schizophrenia sometimes considers this more debilitating than hallucinations, because they don't respond to antipsychotics.

kyleyeats 4y ago

If you're uncomfortable with the term 'schizoid,' you can try medicating the heck out of it and calling it ADHD.

Cornelius267 4y ago
These are different things. They may share some overlapping symptoms, perhaps even some similar brain changes, but the internal phenomenology of them are quite different. They are not exclusive, but nor are they the same thing.
- kyleyeats 4y ago
  No, they're just different words and different times. Schizoids have a false mask they use to interact with others. If we could have, we would have medicated them back then so that they're always presenting with the false mask instead of their "wrong" asocial presentation. That's what ADHD is. We didn't suddenly stop having schizoids and start having a bunch of ADHD people.
  - Cornelius267 4y ago
    No, they are different things. I am honestly quite confused as to how you could think that they were the same thing. They both exist as a constellation of separate diagnostic criteria, for example, and the internal phenomenology of both is different. You can have one, but not the other, or you could have both. For example, here's a quora where someone with both talks about it: https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-ADHD-and-schizoid-personality-disorder-I-have-been-diagnosed-ADHD-and-only-recently-discovered-SPD-however-I-feel-I-strongly-identify-with-both https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-ADHD-an... Or if you prefer a more 'scientific' source, here's one examining the comorbidity of ADHD and certain disorders, among which Schizoid Personality Disorder is one: https://www.elsevier.es/en-revista-revista-psiquiatria-salud-mental-486-articulo-comorbidity-personality-disorders-attention-deficit-hyperactivity-S217350501830030X https://www.elsevier.es/en-revista-revista-psiquiatria-salud... They find a correlation, yes, but they are certainly not one and the same.
    - kyleyeats 4y ago
      I mean, do you think ADHD is new? Did it just not exist before 1990 or whenever it was made up? Do you think any medical condition before then covers what ADHD is/was? Lance Armstrong when he is biking and Lance Armstrong when he is recovering are not the same either. But Lance can take drugs to get more of the biking time and less of the recovering time. This is how SPD and ADHD work. ADHD is just a medicated false mask that a schizoid person can maintain for longer periods of time than usual, without episodes of hermitude to recharge. They're doping. Failure to maintain the mask looks like a breakdown in attention/focus. People do long, focused work because of the expectations of others. Schizoids don't experience that, but instead basically run on obsession. They stop working when that fizzles out. On pills, though, they can work forever. The 'scientific' people serve the people making the pills and nobody else. They rename everything every few years to sell more pills. If you want a proper take on SPD, look up Millon and his subtypes. Most of the "knowledge" of conditions in the zeitgeist comes from prescription drug commercials.
      - intelVISA 4y ago
hosh 4y ago
SPD shares more similarities to Narcissitic Personality Disorder than it does with ADHD -- not in terms of effect and imposition on other people, but rather in the lived experience of self and other, self and world. I don't think SPD (or NPD) are something you can medicate.
- plutonorm 4y ago
  Perhaps long acting oxytocin.
  - hosh 4y ago
    If we're going that route, I think it's more likely we'll see clinical outcomes with therupeutic use of psilosybin or MDMA. I don't think it is so much that the brain needs to be tweaked, but that experiencing self, other, and world in a different ways can transform those in a way that does not require ongoing medication.
- kyleyeats 4y ago
  They're also kinda opposites. The cure for NPD is isolation and the cure for SPD is being around people (agreed-- neither are in pill form yet). They both have immutable internal status, but the narcissist's is very low while the schizoid's is very high. The best example IMO of a cured narcissist is Larry Lawton, who faced a long period of isolation in prison. He's on Youtube.

rnxrx 4y ago

The dilemma with these sorts of discussions always seems to come back to where the line is drawn between the personality and the disorder. Clearly there are some pathologies whose features manifest in ways that are dangerous (..to one's self and/or others) but it's not clear to me which of the criteria above rise from being facets of ordinary personalities and become truly pathological. This seems to also coincide with other literature that describes those with SPD as being among the least likely to seek treatment.

wooque 4y ago

That sounds like advanced depression

uoaei 4y ago
I see it as "depression with an onset in early life, probably from neglectful parenting".
- agumonkey 4y ago
  pardon me for bringing the lineage argument, very often a neglecting person was neglected.. so on and so forth

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

elliotec 4y ago

The author did not need to define schizoid because: 1. It is their blog, and they probably assume their audience is educated in what schizoid means or is capable of looking it up. 2. Schizoid does not colloquially refer to schizophrenia, and schizophrenia is not a pejorative for "crazy," these are both real and distinct (but related) disorders that do not require anyone talking about them to dichotomize them from what you might assume people misconstrue their false definitions as. Also, it's not an "extreme form of introversion" - it's much more than that, and putting it that way minimizes the serious nature of the disorder.

belkarx 4y ago
You're incorrect on point 2. In many communities, schizoid/schizo does refer in a derogatory/shorthand manner to schizophrenia and many more people are familiar with schizophrenia than schizoid disorder, so that is more likely to be the immediate assumption.
MichaelCollins 4y ago
> 2. Schizoid does not colloquially refer to schizophrenia It often does colloquially refer to schizophrenia, I've heard people use the word this way for as long as I can remember. General purpose English dictionaries document this colloquial meaning, I checked several to be sure: "(archaic) schizophrenic" https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/schizoid https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/schizoid "characterized by, resulting from, tending toward, or suggestive of schizophrenia" https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/schizoid https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/schizoid "suffering from or behaving as if suffering from schizophrenia" https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/schizoid https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/schizoid "Informal. of or relating to schizophrenia or to multiple personality." https://www.dictionary.com/browse/schizoid https://www.dictionary.com/browse/schizoid "Someone who is schizoid has schizophrenia" https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/schizoid https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/schizoi...

lofatdairy 4y ago

I assumed that it was a reference to D&G's Anti-Oedipus, that definition seems to make a bit more sense.

anvic 4y ago

Schizoid doesn't colloquially refer to schizophrenia.

richbell 4y ago
It kind of does, even if mistakenly. People use "schizo" as a derogatory way to refer to schizophrenic and "schizoid" isn't a commonly used term; I have seen people use it this way.

agumonkey 4y ago

The sexuality part is interesting to me, because gross biomechanics aside, it's one intense merging with someone else emotions. I'd be very happy to find places or people to discuss the neuropsy or neurobiology of this.

openfuture 4y ago

Sounds like someone who has been betrayed one to many times.