5 ms·

Ask HN: What are the Maxwell's equations of dancing?

16 points by textread 4y ago

I want to learn the BASIC minimum building blocks that make me Turing Complete to dance to any song in any nightclub. Are there any worthy 'Dancing for programmers' courses .

eesmith 4y ago
Practice. More specifically, go to the clubs you like, see what others do, try it at home. Swaying with a beer bottle in your hand is a popular entry point. Try to not be self-conscious - people really aren't going to care. You won't be Turing-complete. If the DJ inserts YMCA or Macarena something else with well-known choreography, you'll have to pick up the larger pattern.
- textread 4y ago
  I will keep the beer trick in mind as a quick hideout :)
marssaxman 4y ago
I admire the nerdly way you've framed this question, but nightclub dancing doesn't work that way. Performers on stage or in videos have choreographed dance sequences, but people dancing in clubs just move to the beat, any old way they feel like. When I started going to clubs, I fell back on the ballroom dance steps I'd learned in my teens. That was sort of overkill, but it gave me something to think about until I conquered my anxiety. Just move your feet to the beat, keep your upper body relaxed, and don't think about it too much - nobody else is! If you keep dancing you will develop more of a vocabulary over time. Watch what other people do, maybe add a little of that flavor to your own motion. Then shut your eyes and see what feels good. Don't take it too seriously.
- textread 4y ago
  Thank you for helping a friend out. You have calmed me :)
apeace 4y ago
My breakthrough came when I stopped thinking of dancing as a way to impress women, and started thinking of it as a way to have fun with my friends. I don't know if dating is what's on your mind, but I know for many people they see "dancing in a club" as some sort of ritual you're supposed to learn to attract a mate. My advice is to ask some close friends to go dancing with you. Stand in a group, do whatever you want, your friends aren't going to judge you. Focus on having fun. Make it silly if you want to. If you do that, everyone around you will have fun, too.
- the_only_law 4y ago
  This is what happened to me, but I require copious amounts of alcohol to get started.
  - textread 4y ago
    Alcohol is bad brother, esp when used in the context of 'require' :)
- textread 4y ago
  My friends tell me that I have to learn. The trouble is that all of them are really good dancers, so I stand out as a sore thumb. Their advice is vague:- "Don't think about it. Just do it" "Don't be soo digital, be a bit analogue" "I encourage you to think more like SOFT COMPUTING, not instructions for a CPU"
  - kleer001 4y ago
    Here's some real advice from a life-time fun-time dancer: Isolate and duplicate. Start with one arm. See what someone else is doing with that arm. Do that. Move on to other parts. Both arms, both legs, torso, hips, head and neck. Then get them to work together. Study fun looking small loop dances from the 70's and 80's and so on. You can floss, do the cabbage patch, the robot and on and on. Get one down and then another. Copy and paste one bit from one to another. Slap 'em around. But most of all watch other people. Then again, there's the chance that you have no rhythm and you're a hopeless left footer. Which is good, actually. It means you're free.
dragonwriter 4y ago
Different musical styles are traditionally associated with different club dance styles (and, while they sometimes aren’t separate named styles, solo and partner dancing involve some different skills, too.) There are transferrable basics (though, unlike computing, the minimum set of prmitives to cover the whole space is quite large), but, I think it would be difficult to pick them up outside of the context of particular styles.
- textread 4y ago
  Let us assume we pick the 'Hip Hop' style just for discussion. What would be the minimum 20% set of primitives to cover the 80% hiphop style space?
Wahba 4y ago
jungturk 4y ago
Probly more akin to Feynman diagrams, with the steps/building blocks being the intermediate particles. Youtube does a good job of cataloging those (e.g. "hiphop dance move basics") but at least as important are the conserved quantities in play that define the transformations that can occur in the vertices (e.g. balance, momentum, rotation, strength, flexibility, coordination, etc...). All of these are cultivated via the "drill it til you kill it" program, so it's maybe less important in the early days to master the standard model and more important to work any 2 to 5 steps that you see and like and get them into a sequence that feels balanced, smooth, repeatable, etc... while developing a great sense of where your body is in space, how its moving, and where it can be next (without injuring yourself or others).
- textread 4y ago
  Thank you so much! this is a great mental model for me to visualize as I learn. Is Steezy.co any good? Or Youtube catalogue is good enough?
impendia 4y ago
You might enjoy swing/lindy hop or ballroom lessons. (I certainly have!) There are individual moves that one learns, as well as big-picture principles that tie them together. As a nerd myself, I've gravitated towards hobbies that were somewhat methodical, that one consciously learns -- and swing dancing has definitely been among the most fun.
- jollyllama 4y ago
  Yes, the structure of swing, blues, and other varieties of ballroom are the best way for people who need structure to get into dance; I cannot stress this enough. You can also check out group dances like Ceili, Balfolk, and.. Contra, I Think? They have the same thing going for them.
- textread 4y ago
  > There are individual moves that one learns, as well as big-picture principles that tie them together. This seems like an achievable approach for my beginner level. Will save 'Swing/Lindy hop or Ballroom' in my notes. Thank you for sharing your experience!
- 7373737373 4y ago
  You might love https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Square_dance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Square_dance, it's the most methodical type of dance I have seen so far
exolymph 4y ago
One such building block is hip isolations: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JARim_SDKo4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JARim_SDKo4
- textread 4y ago
  Thank you for providing one of the equations :)
peter_d_sherman 4y ago
Greetings! I don't as-of-yet know you; you don't as-of-yet know me; so my response is based on the very limited amount of information I am able to infer from your question... What I am able to infer (and please correct me if I am wrong!) is as follows: 1) You are (predominantly!) a left-brain type of person. That is, you like STEM subjects (Science, Technology, Engineering, Math, Programming, etc., etc.) 2) You want to not just participate effectively in, but become a master of what can be thought of as a predominantly right-brained (Art, Music, etc.) talent, that is, dancing... 3) That you are a novice, a neophyte, a beginner -- with respect to dancing, specifically, nightclub dancing -- which you wish to get really good at. Now, if any of these inferences are incorrect, then kindly correct me, and/or provide more information! OK, let's get started! First question: Is walking, actual walking, like walking around, perambulating, walking around -- is walking dancing? ? If the answer is "no" -- then I have an exercise for you to try! <g> What I want you to do -- is to put on your favorite dance music (that is, music with a clearly defined beat to it) -- and without thinking about it -- to walk around! Like think of something different other than your walking... or attend to some task while walking that still requires you to walk -- while still listening to your favorite dance music with its beat! Now, after you've taken your conscious attention off of your walking for awhile and walked around a bit with the music playing -- put your conscious attention back on your walk! You should notice -- that the speed of your walking, the rhythm of your pace -- has precisely lined up (is in sync!) with the beat pattern of the music! In other words, if you're not thinking about it, not consciously trying to adjust the speed/rate/rhythm of your walking -- then you'll find that the beats and the moves just "get in sync" naturally! So now the question... What is this phenomena, and why does it occur? You see, this phenomena is latent to every human being! Every human being will automatically do this, that is, get in a "sync" with music -- but in order for them to do this, the song has to be catchy, it has to have a beat, and the human has to not consciously try to control their walk! Another example without walking: You could listen to your favorite music, and tap out a beat with a pencil or pen on a table! Or same thing, but use a drumkit! (Drumming, is incidentally, sort of like the "2D version" of dancing -- which is sort of the "3D version"!) You see, being able to follow a beat rhymically -- is the key infrastructure, the key building block, the cornerstone -- to all forms of dance which follow! It's sort of like the Y-Combinator or LISP Atom or NAND gate or 1 or 0 -- the building block for all that follows! Will that knowledge turn you into John Travolta or the most famous dancer on YouTube overnight? Not likely -- but it's lesson 0.0.0 in "understanding Dance" -- the most fundamental building-block! There's more to this -- there's a lot more! If you're interested, why not shoot me an email: peter.d.sherman@gmail.com -- and I'll tell you what else I know...
openfuture 4y ago
I think you'd find more interesting theories if you go to martial artists, fundamentally what you are doing is shifting you balance rythmically.. unless you are trying to learn the social aspects, in which case I recommend never underestimating how lonely people are.
d--b 4y ago
1. Move all limbs 2. Follow the music's rythm 3. Don't touch anyone else 4. Don't spill your drink

16 points by textread 4y ago

I want to learn the BASIC minimum building blocks that make me Turing Complete to dance to any song in any nightclub. Are there any worthy 'Dancing for programmers' courses .

eesmith 4y ago

Practice. More specifically, go to the clubs you like, see what others do, try it at home. Swaying with a beer bottle in your hand is a popular entry point. Try to not be self-conscious - people really aren't going to care. You won't be Turing-complete. If the DJ inserts YMCA or Macarena something else with well-known choreography, you'll have to pick up the larger pattern.

textread 4y ago
I will keep the beer trick in mind as a quick hideout :)

marssaxman 4y ago

I admire the nerdly way you've framed this question, but nightclub dancing doesn't work that way. Performers on stage or in videos have choreographed dance sequences, but people dancing in clubs just move to the beat, any old way they feel like. When I started going to clubs, I fell back on the ballroom dance steps I'd learned in my teens. That was sort of overkill, but it gave me something to think about until I conquered my anxiety. Just move your feet to the beat, keep your upper body relaxed, and don't think about it too much - nobody else is! If you keep dancing you will develop more of a vocabulary over time. Watch what other people do, maybe add a little of that flavor to your own motion. Then shut your eyes and see what feels good. Don't take it too seriously.

textread 4y ago
Thank you for helping a friend out. You have calmed me :)

apeace 4y ago

My breakthrough came when I stopped thinking of dancing as a way to impress women, and started thinking of it as a way to have fun with my friends. I don't know if dating is what's on your mind, but I know for many people they see "dancing in a club" as some sort of ritual you're supposed to learn to attract a mate. My advice is to ask some close friends to go dancing with you. Stand in a group, do whatever you want, your friends aren't going to judge you. Focus on having fun. Make it silly if you want to. If you do that, everyone around you will have fun, too.

the_only_law 4y ago
This is what happened to me, but I require copious amounts of alcohol to get started.
- textread 4y ago
  Alcohol is bad brother, esp when used in the context of 'require' :)
textread 4y ago
My friends tell me that I have to learn. The trouble is that all of them are really good dancers, so I stand out as a sore thumb. Their advice is vague:- "Don't think about it. Just do it" "Don't be soo digital, be a bit analogue" "I encourage you to think more like SOFT COMPUTING, not instructions for a CPU"
- kleer001 4y ago
  Here's some real advice from a life-time fun-time dancer: Isolate and duplicate. Start with one arm. See what someone else is doing with that arm. Do that. Move on to other parts. Both arms, both legs, torso, hips, head and neck. Then get them to work together. Study fun looking small loop dances from the 70's and 80's and so on. You can floss, do the cabbage patch, the robot and on and on. Get one down and then another. Copy and paste one bit from one to another. Slap 'em around. But most of all watch other people. Then again, there's the chance that you have no rhythm and you're a hopeless left footer. Which is good, actually. It means you're free.

dragonwriter 4y ago

Different musical styles are traditionally associated with different club dance styles (and, while they sometimes aren’t separate named styles, solo and partner dancing involve some different skills, too.) There are transferrable basics (though, unlike computing, the minimum set of prmitives to cover the whole space is quite large), but, I think it would be difficult to pick them up outside of the context of particular styles.

textread 4y ago
Let us assume we pick the 'Hip Hop' style just for discussion. What would be the minimum 20% set of primitives to cover the 80% hiphop style space?

Wahba 4y ago

jungturk 4y ago

Probly more akin to Feynman diagrams, with the steps/building blocks being the intermediate particles. Youtube does a good job of cataloging those (e.g. "hiphop dance move basics") but at least as important are the conserved quantities in play that define the transformations that can occur in the vertices (e.g. balance, momentum, rotation, strength, flexibility, coordination, etc...). All of these are cultivated via the "drill it til you kill it" program, so it's maybe less important in the early days to master the standard model and more important to work any 2 to 5 steps that you see and like and get them into a sequence that feels balanced, smooth, repeatable, etc... while developing a great sense of where your body is in space, how its moving, and where it can be next (without injuring yourself or others).

textread 4y ago
Thank you so much! this is a great mental model for me to visualize as I learn. Is Steezy.co any good? Or Youtube catalogue is good enough?

impendia 4y ago

You might enjoy swing/lindy hop or ballroom lessons. (I certainly have!) There are individual moves that one learns, as well as big-picture principles that tie them together. As a nerd myself, I've gravitated towards hobbies that were somewhat methodical, that one consciously learns -- and swing dancing has definitely been among the most fun.

jollyllama 4y ago
Yes, the structure of swing, blues, and other varieties of ballroom are the best way for people who need structure to get into dance; I cannot stress this enough. You can also check out group dances like Ceili, Balfolk, and.. Contra, I Think? They have the same thing going for them.
textread 4y ago
> There are individual moves that one learns, as well as big-picture principles that tie them together. This seems like an achievable approach for my beginner level. Will save 'Swing/Lindy hop or Ballroom' in my notes. Thank you for sharing your experience!
7373737373 4y ago
You might love https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Square_dance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Square_dance, it's the most methodical type of dance I have seen so far

exolymph 4y ago

One such building block is hip isolations: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JARim_SDKo4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JARim_SDKo4

textread 4y ago
Thank you for providing one of the equations :)

peter_d_sherman 4y ago

Greetings! I don't as-of-yet know you; you don't as-of-yet know me; so my response is based on the very limited amount of information I am able to infer from your question... What I am able to infer (and please correct me if I am wrong!) is as follows: 1) You are (predominantly!) a left-brain type of person. That is, you like STEM subjects (Science, Technology, Engineering, Math, Programming, etc., etc.) 2) You want to not just participate effectively in, but become a master of what can be thought of as a predominantly right-brained (Art, Music, etc.) talent, that is, dancing... 3) That you are a novice, a neophyte, a beginner -- with respect to dancing, specifically, nightclub dancing -- which you wish to get really good at. Now, if any of these inferences are incorrect, then kindly correct me, and/or provide more information! OK, let's get started! First question: Is walking, actual walking, like walking around, perambulating, walking around -- is walking dancing? ? If the answer is "no" -- then I have an exercise for you to try! <g> What I want you to do -- is to put on your favorite dance music (that is, music with a clearly defined beat to it) -- and without thinking about it -- to walk around! Like think of something different other than your walking... or attend to some task while walking that still requires you to walk -- while still listening to your favorite dance music with its beat! Now, after you've taken your conscious attention off of your walking for awhile and walked around a bit with the music playing -- put your conscious attention back on your walk! You should notice -- that the speed of your walking, the rhythm of your pace -- has precisely lined up (is in sync!) with the beat pattern of the music! In other words, if you're not thinking about it, not consciously trying to adjust the speed/rate/rhythm of your walking -- then you'll find that the beats and the moves just "get in sync" naturally! So now the question... What is this phenomena, and why does it occur? You see, this phenomena is latent to every human being! Every human being will automatically do this, that is, get in a "sync" with music -- but in order for them to do this, the song has to be catchy, it has to have a beat, and the human has to not consciously try to control their walk! Another example without walking: You could listen to your favorite music, and tap out a beat with a pencil or pen on a table! Or same thing, but use a drumkit! (Drumming, is incidentally, sort of like the "2D version" of dancing -- which is sort of the "3D version"!) You see, being able to follow a beat rhymically -- is the key infrastructure, the key building block, the cornerstone -- to all forms of dance which follow! It's sort of like the Y-Combinator or LISP Atom or NAND gate or 1 or 0 -- the building block for all that follows! Will that knowledge turn you into John Travolta or the most famous dancer on YouTube overnight? Not likely -- but it's lesson 0.0.0 in "understanding Dance" -- the most fundamental building-block! There's more to this -- there's a lot more! If you're interested, why not shoot me an email: peter.d.sherman@gmail.com -- and I'll tell you what else I know...

openfuture 4y ago

I think you'd find more interesting theories if you go to martial artists, fundamentally what you are doing is shifting you balance rythmically.. unless you are trying to learn the social aspects, in which case I recommend never underestimating how lonely people are.

d--b 4y ago

1. Move all limbs 2. Follow the music's rythm 3. Don't touch anyone else 4. Don't spill your drink