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One of the things that makes ecological protection so hellishly difficult is that the "environmentally minded" side of the argument pitches all of its propagan
by quacked 4y ago
One of the things that makes ecological protection so hellishly difficult is that the "environmentally minded" side
of the argument pitches all of its propaganda assuming that the recipients of the propaganda are already in line with many other values.
As an example, the two major save-the-environment angles in the US are the 'hippie' ("We need to save the forests and the Earth because all of the species need to live in harmony") and the 'scientist' ("We need to save the environment because we are all going to die from ecosystem collapse and catastrophic flooding"). Both of these personas are astonishingly easy to caricature and it's effortless for right-wing political leaders to find the silliest and most ridiculous examples to paint as representative of the movement.
If you want to get 'conservatives' to agree to do something about conservation, you need to appeal to the 'religious' ("Did God give us these gifts so we could destroy them in our own name?") and the 'nationalist' ("For centuries these proud forests have stood as a symbol and vital backbone of our nation's economy and spirit, and only powerful and clever stewardship will allow us to both profit from our natural resources as well as hand them down in full strength to our grandchildren so they can continue to steer the nation to prosperity").
- kennywinker 4y agoCriticizing someones methods of activism is always kinda a joke to me. If you care, and think you have a better way to win people over - MAKE YOUR CASE - don’t tell others they’re doing it wrong and if they just said the right words you’d get on board and help. The scientist making a religious argument, when they didn’t believe it, is just as easily dismissed as the scientist making the science argument. Turns out you need pastors and religious leaders and conservatives to make those arguments to conservatives. Why aren’t they? You tell me - i’d guess that a few do and the audience would rather hear other things - plus all the nice oil money goes to media that pitches climate denial messages
- quacked 4y ago> Criticizing someones methods of activism is always kinda a joke to me. If you care, and think you have a better way to win people over - MAKE YOUR CASE - don’t tell others they’re doing it wrong and if they just said the right words you’d get on board and help. Point to where I said I wasn't on board. Criticism of ineffective activism is necessary for anyone who continually beats the same message and then has no idea why they keep losing elections and failing to achieve their goals. "Why do they keep voting right-wing?"
- kennywinker 4y agoIf you’re on board, and have a better argument than you see being made for why others should be on board as well - it’s time to make your case. The climate isn’t going to wait.
- quacked 4y agoI literally did made my case. Real climate action done with majority consensus must win the support of people who don't currently believe in environmental causes. This will require a change in messaging in order to capture opponents. The alternative is violent suppression of consumption and industry, which I am also open to.
- strainer 4y agoCriticism is of interest to us when we are serious about achieving success. When really trying to achieve something, ideas of fatal flaws are fascinating. On the other hand during a performance, criticism must be effectively ignored.
- MichaelCollins 4y ago> If you want to get 'conservatives' to agree to do something about conservation, you need to appeal to the 'religious' ("Did God give us these gifts so we could destroy them in our own name?") You can't win that game against their own priests, particularly if you don't even believe the religious arguments you're trying to make. Atheists smugly and self-servingly explaining Christianity to Christians with arguments the atheist doesn't even believe himself is something they're already very familiar and derisive of. Use arguments you actually believe yourself. People can tell when you aren't.
- quacked 4y agoWhat makes you think I don't believe in God, and what makes you think that no one who believes in God wants to protect the environment?
- MichaelCollins 4y agoIf you do, then knock yourself out and go preach to your fellow Christians. Something about the tone of your comment lead me to believe that you, like myself, do not.
- quacked 4y agoYou are perfectly demonstrating the total inability of left-wing people to govern effectively. The Christians make up a huge percentage of people who oppose climate reform. If you want non-violent, non-authoritarian action on environmental protection, they need to be on board. Why is this principle difficult for you and your co-believers to understand?
- MichaelCollins 4y agoCurious assumptions in this post, but okay. Turnabout is fair play.