3 ms·

“I’m feeling nothing at all” to “I’m useless and the world is going to hell” I don't see anything wrong with people feeling like any of those 2 from time to ti

by sage76 4y ago

“I’m feeling nothing at all” to “I’m useless and the world is going to hell” I don't see anything wrong with people feeling like any of those 2 from time to time. If it is continuous and long term, then it's a matter of concern.

thatcat 4y ago
Its the transition from one extreme to the other with no gradient that makes it emotionally weird.
- Kye 4y ago
  It's unreasonable for people to ask men to be better about emotions and then expect them to immediately go from being socialized to suppress them to being emotionally mature without some growing pains. Growth takes time and support, and they're less likely to try again if the support vanishes when they try to grow.
  - sage76 4y ago
    Men are being held up to unreasonable emotional standards in general. No weakness, no crying, no feeling like shit ever. These standards lend more and more credence to the thing that Chris Rock said, "Only women and children are loved unconditionally. Men need to provide something to be loved." Of course, these standards are being enforced by men too, not just women. But it does not surprise me that so many men I know have checked out of one or more aspects of life.
    - leobg 4y ago
      What Chris Rock said there is the textbook excuse of a person with an avoidant attachment style: Pushing the other person away and not allowing them to get closer by telling yourself that they can only need you, but never ever love you. If you hear that voice inside of you, it‘s „the devil talking“. I say this as someone who has gone through all of this, and a lot more. Instead of seeing these feelings as proof that the world is out to punish you, it‘s much more useful to see that pain as a signal. A signal that tells you that you‘re likely carrying some deep bullshit around from your past and early childhood. And that dating and relationships are here for you not as consumables to fill a need, or as a measure for your own self-worth, but as a challenge, a „task“ in your life that gives you the chance to grow beyond your childhood patterns, and to take an active role in redefining not only your relationships to „woman“, but to mankind as a whole. If you‘re on HN, you‘re very likely an intelligent, resourceful, curious person. You have most likely solved problems in your life that have been much, much tougher. It would be a pity if you ran away from this one.
      - sage76 4y ago
        You should read stories of what happened to a lot of men when they opened up to their wives or other long term partners. It just seems rare that women can maintain attraction after seeing a man be weak and vulnerable.
        leobg 4y ago
        If anybody has had such a story, feel free to message me and we can talk about it. I won’t claim that this is always the case, but the interpretation that it is opening up and showing vulnerability that is causing a loss of attraction is almost always a misinterpretation. And a very dangerous one at that, because it prevents learning and solidifies the very problem that caused the relationship breakdown in the first place.
  - leobg 4y ago
    Of course! Growth takes time. And it‘s normal that beginners start out with very little refinement. That‘s true of any endeavor in life. But what is also unreasonable is to expect that someone else out there („people“? „society“? „women“?) should be responsible for your growth. That might have been true in tribal societies („It takes a village to raise a child“). But live in an individualistic society. And just as people on the street won‘t go out of their way to help you learn, say, regular expressions, they won‘t do that to help you get laid, or find love, or make your marriage work. With Regex, if you had books or articles that made it sound like an intractible problem, you‘d ditch those sources and find better ones. With women and relationships, though, guys just seem to happily accept the conclusion that things are rigged against them because they are men. Like some mirror-feminist ideology where it becomes a badge of honor to demonstrate that a man needs a woman as much „as a fish needs a bicycle“. What a silly game! I once read about a psychologist who said that, in America, people mentally map the concept of „sex“ to the idea of „war“. „Battle of the sexes“ - that kind of thing. But one makes a mistake when one takes that map to be the territory. This „battle of the sexes“ thing is just one way of ascribing meaning to observations (and of filtering them). It‘s just a story. An ideology. You only have to play by its rules if you subscribe to it.

by sage76 4y ago

thatcat 4y ago

Its the transition from one extreme to the other with no gradient that makes it emotionally weird.

Kye 4y ago
It's unreasonable for people to ask men to be better about emotions and then expect them to immediately go from being socialized to suppress them to being emotionally mature without some growing pains. Growth takes time and support, and they're less likely to try again if the support vanishes when they try to grow.
- sage76 4y ago
  Men are being held up to unreasonable emotional standards in general. No weakness, no crying, no feeling like shit ever. These standards lend more and more credence to the thing that Chris Rock said, "Only women and children are loved unconditionally. Men need to provide something to be loved." Of course, these standards are being enforced by men too, not just women. But it does not surprise me that so many men I know have checked out of one or more aspects of life.
  - leobg 4y ago
    What Chris Rock said there is the textbook excuse of a person with an avoidant attachment style: Pushing the other person away and not allowing them to get closer by telling yourself that they can only need you, but never ever love you. If you hear that voice inside of you, it‘s „the devil talking“. I say this as someone who has gone through all of this, and a lot more. Instead of seeing these feelings as proof that the world is out to punish you, it‘s much more useful to see that pain as a signal. A signal that tells you that you‘re likely carrying some deep bullshit around from your past and early childhood. And that dating and relationships are here for you not as consumables to fill a need, or as a measure for your own self-worth, but as a challenge, a „task“ in your life that gives you the chance to grow beyond your childhood patterns, and to take an active role in redefining not only your relationships to „woman“, but to mankind as a whole. If you‘re on HN, you‘re very likely an intelligent, resourceful, curious person. You have most likely solved problems in your life that have been much, much tougher. It would be a pity if you ran away from this one.
    - sage76 4y ago
      You should read stories of what happened to a lot of men when they opened up to their wives or other long term partners. It just seems rare that women can maintain attraction after seeing a man be weak and vulnerable.
      - leobg 4y ago
        If anybody has had such a story, feel free to message me and we can talk about it. I won’t claim that this is always the case, but the interpretation that it is opening up and showing vulnerability that is causing a loss of attraction is almost always a misinterpretation. And a very dangerous one at that, because it prevents learning and solidifies the very problem that caused the relationship breakdown in the first place.
- leobg 4y ago
  Of course! Growth takes time. And it‘s normal that beginners start out with very little refinement. That‘s true of any endeavor in life. But what is also unreasonable is to expect that someone else out there („people“? „society“? „women“?) should be responsible for your growth. That might have been true in tribal societies („It takes a village to raise a child“). But live in an individualistic society. And just as people on the street won‘t go out of their way to help you learn, say, regular expressions, they won‘t do that to help you get laid, or find love, or make your marriage work. With Regex, if you had books or articles that made it sound like an intractible problem, you‘d ditch those sources and find better ones. With women and relationships, though, guys just seem to happily accept the conclusion that things are rigged against them because they are men. Like some mirror-feminist ideology where it becomes a badge of honor to demonstrate that a man needs a woman as much „as a fish needs a bicycle“. What a silly game! I once read about a psychologist who said that, in America, people mentally map the concept of „sex“ to the idea of „war“. „Battle of the sexes“ - that kind of thing. But one makes a mistake when one takes that map to be the territory. This „battle of the sexes“ thing is just one way of ascribing meaning to observations (and of filtering them). It‘s just a story. An ideology. You only have to play by its rules if you subscribe to it.