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That's ... not how this works. This is not a zero-sum thing. (Even if there are parts of the problem where the actual conflicts are zero-sum, ie. there's a limi
by pas 4y ago
That's ... not how this works. This is not a zero-sum thing. (Even if there are parts of the problem where the actual conflicts are zero-sum, ie. there's a limit of how many first-year students can fit into classes, etc.)
Discriminating against already well off groups to help chronically not well-off groups (affirmative action) is of course discrimination but the consequence is very unlikely to cause the well-off groups to suddenly find themselves at the other end of the spectrum. (Mostly because they have a lot of other opportunities... that's why they're well-off. Of course it's not that simple, because there's stratification of these groups themselves, so it's very important to look at people individually, and don't simply give them plus/minus points just because of an external trait. Eg. skin color.)
- zmgsabst 4y agoSaying that it’s okay to discriminate against poor Whites, Jews, and Asians because some are rich is entirely racist: You’re viewing people as defined by their race, not their individual attributes and histories.
- pas 4y agoNo one said that, and I don't view people as that. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
- HyperSane 4y agoIbram X Kendi does.
- pas 4y agoI haven't read anything from him (except that one line, I assume, you quoted a few comments back), but now I'm interested. Can you cite the relevant parts?
- akomtu 4y agoHis name is Ibram Rogers Kendi, and under this name he has published books that make his "anti-racism" a moderate view. He's switched to this X pseudonym to make readers forget what kind of extremist he had been.
- HyperSane 4y agoKendi argues that policy outcomes are central in measuring and effecting racial equity. He has said, "All along we've been trying to change people, when we really need to change policies." When speaking in November 2020 to the Alliance for Early Success, Kendi was asked if that even means abiding racist behavior and attitudes if it leads to winning an antiracist policy. Kendi answered with a definitive yes. "I want things to change for millions of people – millions of children – as opposed to trying to change one individual person." Kendi provoked controversy when he tweeted about the relationship between Amy Coney Barrett, President Donald Trump's third Supreme Court nominee, and two of her seven children, who had been adopted from an orphanage in Haiti. Kendi said: Some White colonizers 'adopted' Black children. They 'civilized' these 'savage' children in the 'superior' ways of White people, while using them as props in their lifelong pictures of denial, while cutting the biological parents of these children out of the picture of humanity. And whether this is Barrett or not is not the point. It is a belief too many White people have: if they have or adopt a child of color, then they can't be racist. His remarks were interpreted as criticizing interracial adoption. A substantial backlash against Kendi ensued. He later said his comments were taken out of context and that he does not believe that white parents of black children are inherently racist.
- pas 4y agoThanks for the detailed reply! I can't really say much about this. It's typical vague bullshit. Kendi projects everything onto white people. (This argument/rant that "white person does X and now they think racism is no more" or "white person does X and now white person is automatically a hypocrite" is typical in radical social justice texts. Here he hedges it with "too many" white people have this belief.) That said, I don't see where they say that fuck poor Asians, or where they say that being black entitles someone to more social help/justice than being a poor Asian.
- zmgsabst 4y ago> Discriminating against already well off groups to help chronically not well-off groups (affirmative action) is of course discrimination You said exactly that.
- pas 4y agoWhat I said is not what you claimed I said. I did not say that it's okay, I stated a simple fact, that positive discrimination is discrimination too. Then I tried to explain the likely consequence of one usual version of that, and then I explicitly said that it's not that simple, because looking at ethnic groups and deciding the fate of individuals, just because they belong to that ethnic group, is almost textbook racism, as you also pointed out.
- HyperSane 4y agoRacial discrimination is always wrong for any reason at any time.