4 ms·

There's a strong bully/prison experiment vibe to these companies. You get used to abusing people because all your friends are hi-fiving you about being good at

by seiji 15y ago

There's a strong bully/prison experiment vibe to these companies. You get used to abusing people because all your friends are hi-fiving you about being good at abusing people. The High Holy developers sit around thinking up ways of manipulating people into addiction. The developers and management get positive social reinforcement from co-workers and the board when they find another hook into people's brains ("Your character will DIE unless you come back RIGHT NOW!" "You haven't visited in 18 hours, VISIT NOW FOR FREE GIFT!"). Reinforcing shady practices of individuals ("It's not unethical, it's funethical!") over time makes developers and management banish any thought of wrongdoing. Users are just an abstract ID anyway -- an abstract ID with access to a credit card. If someone wants to spend $10,000 per day buying purple carrot pixels, why shouldn't we milk them dry?

teej 15y ago
Your entire comment is bullshit and it pisses me off. You've never worked at Zynga, so to purport that you know exactly what it's like to work there is bullshit. Your comment reflects exactly what Silicon Valley nerds think of Zynga externally. They think that Zynga is nothing but people refining skinner boxes for people to play in. You've probably seen one or two talks of Mark Pincus talking about "doing every dirty trick in the book" or something like that. Have you ever met him? Do you even know the last time he worked directly on a game? You're allowed to have whatever opinion you like, but this opinion is bullshit. Your entire comment is ridiculously biased and unreflective of Zynga internally or externally. ------------------------------ So yes, JonnieCache, there is a stigma for working at these companies. reflected by the parent comment. Is that stigma justified? Absolutely not. There are plenty of other reasons not to like developing at Zynga most people don't talk about: * Zynga is not a technology company first. This means that product & revenue decisions are always prioritized over innovating tech. Most developers aren't comfortable with companies like that. * Zynga isn't accepted as a legit member of "games companies" circles. You can't tell your buddy who works building a PC MMO or console FPS that you're in games because you work at Zynga. You'll get laughed out of the room. * Developers are not decision makers at Zynga. Product managers and game designers call all the shots. So if you're writing code, you're not really "making games" in the traditional sense, you're just implementing someone else's spec. So is Zynga the best place for a dev to work in the valley? It isn't the worst. You'll make more money and get more perks than you would working at a startup, but it won't be personally fulfilling. Do you spend all day scheming ways to exploit people? Fuck no, get over it already.
- jphackworth 15y ago
  Do you spend all day scheming ways to exploit people? Fuck no, get over it already. This is true, but a bit misleading. As an engineer at Zynga, you spend your time developing to spec, not scheming. The game designers are the ones that actually spend all day scheming ways to exploit people. I think the stigma mostly comes from the fact that so many of Zynga's users hate their products. It's not really because of the engineering talent there, it's just how the organization works, but still, it's a stigma that makes sense.
- seiji 15y ago
  Another thing Zynga is great at (and a business practice others follow) is the outright copying of other product's game mechanics and concepts. Hopeful coat tail riding doesn't always pay out. coughMinoMonsterGalaxycough
  - teej 15y ago
    Was FarmVille a direct ripoff of FarmTown? Absolutely. Was CityVille a direct ripoff of the city games before it? Not even close. The personal attack is hilarious. Mike Sego is a good friend and to think that I would outright copy his game is deplorable. When our product releases in the next few weeks, you'll see how different MinoMonsters is.
    - esrauch 15y ago
      I'm confused by this comment, Zynga is moral because it only copies games made by people who aren't personal friends?
  - noahth 15y ago
    Yeah, really offensive how someone ripped off Monster Galaxy's completely original concept, which sprung fully-formed from the untainted mind of Mike Sego. (note: not ripping on Mike, he seems like a really nice, cool guy who's worked hard to build a successful business.) When will this "rip-off" meme finally die? It's entirely absurd and usually reeks of sour grapes.
- 15y ago

by seiji 15y ago

teej 15y ago

Your entire comment is bullshit and it pisses me off. You've never worked at Zynga, so to purport that you know exactly what it's like to work there is bullshit. Your comment reflects exactly what Silicon Valley nerds think of Zynga externally. They think that Zynga is nothing but people refining skinner boxes for people to play in. You've probably seen one or two talks of Mark Pincus talking about "doing every dirty trick in the book" or something like that. Have you ever met him? Do you even know the last time he worked directly on a game? You're allowed to have whatever opinion you like, but this opinion is bullshit. Your entire comment is ridiculously biased and unreflective of Zynga internally or externally. ------------------------------ So yes, JonnieCache, there is a stigma for working at these companies. reflected by the parent comment. Is that stigma justified? Absolutely not. There are plenty of other reasons not to like developing at Zynga most people don't talk about: * Zynga is not a technology company first. This means that product & revenue decisions are always prioritized over innovating tech. Most developers aren't comfortable with companies like that. * Zynga isn't accepted as a legit member of "games companies" circles. You can't tell your buddy who works building a PC MMO or console FPS that you're in games because you work at Zynga. You'll get laughed out of the room. * Developers are not decision makers at Zynga. Product managers and game designers call all the shots. So if you're writing code, you're not really "making games" in the traditional sense, you're just implementing someone else's spec. So is Zynga the best place for a dev to work in the valley? It isn't the worst. You'll make more money and get more perks than you would working at a startup, but it won't be personally fulfilling. Do you spend all day scheming ways to exploit people? Fuck no, get over it already.

jphackworth 15y ago
Do you spend all day scheming ways to exploit people? Fuck no, get over it already. This is true, but a bit misleading. As an engineer at Zynga, you spend your time developing to spec, not scheming. The game designers are the ones that actually spend all day scheming ways to exploit people. I think the stigma mostly comes from the fact that so many of Zynga's users hate their products. It's not really because of the engineering talent there, it's just how the organization works, but still, it's a stigma that makes sense.
seiji 15y ago
Another thing Zynga is great at (and a business practice others follow) is the outright copying of other product's game mechanics and concepts. Hopeful coat tail riding doesn't always pay out. coughMinoMonsterGalaxycough
- teej 15y ago
  Was FarmVille a direct ripoff of FarmTown? Absolutely. Was CityVille a direct ripoff of the city games before it? Not even close. The personal attack is hilarious. Mike Sego is a good friend and to think that I would outright copy his game is deplorable. When our product releases in the next few weeks, you'll see how different MinoMonsters is.
  - esrauch 15y ago
    I'm confused by this comment, Zynga is moral because it only copies games made by people who aren't personal friends?
- noahth 15y ago
  Yeah, really offensive how someone ripped off Monster Galaxy's completely original concept, which sprung fully-formed from the untainted mind of Mike Sego. (note: not ripping on Mike, he seems like a really nice, cool guy who's worked hard to build a successful business.) When will this "rip-off" meme finally die? It's entirely absurd and usually reeks of sour grapes.
15y ago