3 ms·

Then you'd have to get rid of limited liability companies, I don't want to be defeatist but that's not going to happen. There are some instances where it can be

by consp 4y ago

Then you'd have to get rid of limited liability companies, I don't want to be defeatist but that's not going to happen. There are some instances where it can be done but usually it's hard and I've never seen it happen with big companies, only obvious frauds like pyramid schemes.

Thorrez 4y ago
I thought limited liability was about money, not about jail time. They're about insulating the owner from debt. The LLC can go bankrupt without ruining the owner.
- consp 4y ago
  To my knowledge it also shields you from most criminal parts as you can say "It was the lower downs, not my doing" despite it almost always is policy.
  - pkroll 4y ago
    Having the employees is what provides the shield: it becomes harder to prove who exactly, did what.
quantum_magpie 4y ago
If LLC owner is breaking laws they should be punished, up to, and including, jail time.
- Silverback_VII 4y ago
  I would understand your anger if it were about speculation on the price of rice or wheat. but about tickets? come on... Even in the case of food shortage one must ask if speculation does not increase investment and production in the long run.
  - sschueller 4y ago
    You can speculate all you want as long as the law allows it but viagogo is actually breaking laws in some countries (faking names and addresses to purchase tickets, misleading customers, not honering refund policies, etc. ) and should either stop doing so or prevent customers in those countries from purchasing tickets.
hodgesrm 4y ago
LLC is not a shield for criminal conduct. It protects personal assets of the company owners. [0] Generally speaking in American law such protections disappear if you commit fraud or similar malfeasance. For examples, courts will break contracts including liability limits if a party commmits fraud. (IANAL but I read a lot of contracts in my day job.) [0] https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/llc.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/llc.asp
- d110af5ccf 4y ago
  The relevant term is "piercing the corporate veil" and it pretty much only happens if someone intentionally and knowingly engages in criminal acts.
  - senko 4y ago
    > if someone intentionally and knowingly engages in criminal acts. Can you unintentionally and unknowingly engage in a criminal act?
    - d110af5ccf 4y ago
      It depends. At least in the US your intent is important to most laws but not all laws. In other words, the judge or perhaps a jury will decide the answer to your question.
    - TheCoelacanth 4y ago
      It's somewhat rare, but yes[1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strict_liability_(criminal) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strict_liability_(criminal)

by consp 4y ago

Thorrez 4y ago

I thought limited liability was about money, not about jail time. They're about insulating the owner from debt. The LLC can go bankrupt without ruining the owner.

consp 4y ago
To my knowledge it also shields you from most criminal parts as you can say "It was the lower downs, not my doing" despite it almost always is policy.
- pkroll 4y ago
  Having the employees is what provides the shield: it becomes harder to prove who exactly, did what.

quantum_magpie 4y ago

If LLC owner is breaking laws they should be punished, up to, and including, jail time.

Silverback_VII 4y ago
I would understand your anger if it were about speculation on the price of rice or wheat. but about tickets? come on... Even in the case of food shortage one must ask if speculation does not increase investment and production in the long run.
- sschueller 4y ago
  You can speculate all you want as long as the law allows it but viagogo is actually breaking laws in some countries (faking names and addresses to purchase tickets, misleading customers, not honering refund policies, etc. ) and should either stop doing so or prevent customers in those countries from purchasing tickets.

hodgesrm 4y ago

LLC is not a shield for criminal conduct. It protects personal assets of the company owners. [0] Generally speaking in American law such protections disappear if you commit fraud or similar malfeasance. For examples, courts will break contracts including liability limits if a party commmits fraud. (IANAL but I read a lot of contracts in my day job.) [0] https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/llc.asp https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/llc.asp

d110af5ccf 4y ago
The relevant term is "piercing the corporate veil" and it pretty much only happens if someone intentionally and knowingly engages in criminal acts.
- senko 4y ago
  > if someone intentionally and knowingly engages in criminal acts. Can you unintentionally and unknowingly engage in a criminal act?
  - d110af5ccf 4y ago
    It depends. At least in the US your intent is important to most laws but not all laws. In other words, the judge or perhaps a jury will decide the answer to your question.
  - TheCoelacanth 4y ago
    It's somewhat rare, but yes[1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strict_liability_(criminal) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strict_liability_(criminal)