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She hasnt even started as a pm yet the eu issued warnings. Apparently Ursula “has tools”. You can’t make this shit up.
by yrgulation 4y ago
She hasnt even started as a pm yet the eu issued warnings. Apparently Ursula “has tools”. You can’t make this shit up.
- mark_l_watson 4y ago+1 I was also shocked to hear in a news conference the EU president Ursula von der Leyen threaten the Italian voters right before the election. Seriously, I was shocked. So much for believing in democracy. I am very liberal politically, but I 100% support people on the right wing who run into trouble with the Neoliberal overlords. We need to have respect for all people's opinions (that are non-violent, etc.) and support all people's rights to vote as they wish. I think the Neoliberals must envy China's authoritarian control of their population, because that is what I think the Neoliberals want also. BTW, I joined the World Economic Forum for a while just to read directly what they were up to.
- yrgulation 4y agoLikewise, left leaning and i find it shocking. And as much as i want to not criticise the eu and its politics i simply can’t. Always sanctions and threats what happened to cooperation and mutual understanding?
- arinlen 4y ago> +1 I was also shocked to hear in a news conference the EU president Ursula von der Leyen threaten the Italian voters right before the election. This is the very first time I've heard such a thing. Do you have a source showcasing what you claim to be threats?
- miguelazo 4y ago
- tarakat 4y agoDuring a conference on Thursday at Princeton University, an attendant pointed out to von der Leyen that “figures close to Putin” were among candidates for the upcoming legislative election on Sunday. “We’ll see,” she replied. “If things go in a difficult direction — and I’ve spoken about Hungary and Poland — we have the tools.” - https://www.politico.eu/article/italy-election-candidate-warning-ursula-von-der-leyen/ https://www.politico.eu/article/italy-election-candidate-war...
- arinlen 4y ago> “If things go in a difficult direction — and I’ve spoken about Hungary and Poland — we have the tools.” Please explain what led you to interpret this as a threat of any form. The Orban reference was pretty clear. From the article: > "This is a clear reference to the ability of the European Commission to cut funds allocated to member countries when they are deemed to be violating the rule of law."
- miguelazo 4y agoCutting funds allocated to member countries for not voting the way you want seems like a pretty clear threat to me!
- detaro 4y agoThey can't cut funding for "not voting the way they want". Funding can be held back if governments violate treaty obligations, after a lengthy process. (I.e. the other referenced examples have clear reasons why the process is running, and it's not because who the voters voted for ...)
- tarakat 4y agoAnd maybe von der Leyen will lobby for a stricter reading of those treaties if the wrong party gets elected, which is the subtext of her words, obvious to all but the most willfully obtuse.
- PatentlyDC123 4y agoI found this article to cover the quote in her recent speech about "tools." [0] [0] https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/eus-von-der-leyen-delivers-veiled-warning-italys-right-wing-2022-09-23/ https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/eus-von-der-leyen-deliv...
- arinlen 4y agoHere's the quote from the article. > My approach is that whatever democratic government is willing to work with us, we're working together," von der Leyen said at Princeton University in the United States on Thursday, responding to a question on whether there were any concerns with regard to the upcoming elections in Italy. > "If things go in a difficult direction, I've spoken about Hungary and Poland, we have tools," she added. So a liberal democratic organization is prepared to protect itself from sabotage from fascist organizations that are actively manipulated by external actors to undermine them. That's your threat.
- miguelazo 4y agoI assumed that you were using "liberal democratic organization" in jest, but now I am not sure. Would you like to elaborate on your "actively maniuplated by external actors" statement? Is this something like the Russiagate hoax? Are you suggesting Italian voters aren't capable of voting in their own interests?
- mhoad 4y agoIt’s probably more related to the fact that 70% of the country didn’t actually vote for them, it’s hardly the will of the people.
- amadeuspagel 4y agoMore then half of the country voted for her coalition.
- 4y ago
- systemvoltage 4y agoAnother problem is the term Fascism that's been thrown around willy-nilly. I think next time one uses the term, it is probably worth looking up what Fascism really looks like.
- stjohnswarts 4y agoShe's bad for italy but shouldn't be banned on twitter as she hasn't actually done anything yet. That will likely be forthcoming in the coming months. You really should take a look at her party's history. She's a lot like trump. A bit moderate-rightish but she prefers strongmen type leaders like Putin and Berlesconi, which I think speaks for her future plans as to how government "should be run"
- yrgulation 4y agoMy point is that we should respect the people of italy and their choice. We should do the same for hungary and poland. Sanctions and threats polarise voters or may even help their cause. Maybe there is a third option, other than appeasement or threats. Maybe we can try and understand why people of now a third eu member state chose such a political leader.
- 312c 4y ago74% of voters in Italy did not want Meloni.
- yrgulation 4y agoCool, we need to figure out why people dont go out and vote while we do respect those that did. Not saying we should blindly agree with their choice, but it feels like there is so much going on beneath the surface that threats will only make things worse.
- systemvoltage 4y agoThis is probably the most level headed political comment I've read on HN in a long time. Kudos.
- inkywatcher 4y agoAsk a gay person in Orban's Hungary what respecting the will of the voters is like.
- 4y ago