4 ms·

All this time, and technology hasn't solved this issue? Wasn't bitcoin supposed to be applicable here - anonymous transactions? Wasn't the internet supposed to

All this time, and technology hasn't solved this issue? Wasn't bitcoin supposed to be applicable here - anonymous transactions? Wasn't the internet supposed to enable humans to interact at will without censorship?

fknorangesite 4y ago
> Wasn't bitcoin supposed to be applicable here Accepting bitcoin is all well and good, but it doesn't help you much if your customers aren't able/willing to pay with it.
manuelabeledo 4y ago
You can do the same with just cash.
- JoeAltmaier 4y ago
  It won't go in the floppy slot somehow...
- Overtonwindow 4y ago
  But then cash becomes a storage issue. The same way marijuana shops are blocked from depositing their cash into banks, cash with sex workers becomes a problem. How to get it into the banking system without drawing the attention of the police? Even worse, try paying bills with cash. If you'll pardon me, I think cash deposite below $1,000 should be none of the government's business without a valid, specific warrant. If someone wants to sell drugs, sex, or graphics cards on the side for cash, it's none of the government's business.
  - CaptainZapp 4y ago
    > The same way marijuana shops are blocked from depositing their cash into banks, cash with sex workers becomes a problem. Only if sex work is illegal. Which it isn't in significant parts of the developed world. Prostitutes (male or female) here around are taxed like everybody else. In addition they need to be health checked to perform their work. Paying them in cash is really no problem neither for the client nor for the provider.
  - philwelch 4y ago
    $10,000 is the threshold where you have to tell the bank where you got the money. Of course, if you make ten deposits of $1000 to avoid this rule, that’s called “structuring” and is considered a federal offense.
  - dismantlethesun 4y ago
    The police don’t watch cash transactions without reason. If you simply regularly deposit cash, then you only have to declare a business account and no one will take a second look at you at the bank.
  - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
    > someone wants to sell drugs, sex, or graphics cards on the side for cash, it's none of the government's business This is a valid opinion. But it's clearly in the minority. (Counterfactual: there is broad support for drug policy reform [1].) Particularly when one considers the tax consequences. [1] https://www.aclu.org/press-releases/50th-anniversary-war-drugs-poll-shows-majority-voters-support-ending-criminal https://www.aclu.org/press-releases/50th-anniversary-war-dru...
  - wil421 4y ago
    You have a cookie baking or massage business that covers enough to pay a modest mortgage and car. The rest you pay in cash. You give family members down payments to buy property or leases for you.
    - lazide 4y ago
      Aka money laundering (according to the feds)
      - wil421 4y ago
        As long as sex working is illegal they will have to launder the money somehow.
kalleboo 4y ago
Typically technical solutions don't solve social problems
zivkovicp 4y ago
They do, but not if you use a commercial platform. Host your own infrastructure (ftp/email/www/etc.) and use Btc, and you will have a lot more liberty but not "reach"... so you can't have your cake and eat it too. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
SamoyedFurFluff 4y ago
Technology can’t solve primarily cultural issues. The second bitcoin tries to perform the same financial services as a bank (mortgages, lending, checking, savings, interest, etc) that institution using bitcoin will need to do the same “know your customer” behavior that makes it hard for sex workers to get the same financial services.
- nannal 4y ago
  Exchanges already do a decent amount of KYC. Some do not, but they typically have issues interfacing with the traditional banking environment.
- from 4y ago
  Exactly. Backpage took crypto for instance but ultimately if you are convicted of a crime and the government gives you a forfeiture order then it is a crime not to comply. Which is what they did to the tune of millions of dollars.
superkuh 4y ago
Bitcoin actually does play a big role in the online sex industry. Many sex workers and businsses online accept bitcoin and even prefer it. But then there's the problem that the US, and other, government are actively trying to regulate the Bitcoin to fiat gateways out of existence and make it too honerous for them to run their businesses the same way that sex worker businesses are attacked by the payment processors. So once you start working in cryptocurrency not only are the payment processors attacking you now you have the government attacking you too.
kobalsky 4y ago
yes, but for the regular person getting bitcoin is still high friction. I mean on a world when adding one extra step on your checkout will drop your conversion rate, getting people to buy btc before probably pushes you into being unprofitable. this will be true when and IF bitcoin gets to be ubiquitous
DennisP 4y ago
Cryptocurrency can't be a mass-market payment solution until it scales a lot better.
seydor 4y ago
It was, and then governments came

fknorangesite 4y ago

> Wasn't bitcoin supposed to be applicable here Accepting bitcoin is all well and good, but it doesn't help you much if your customers aren't able/willing to pay with it.

manuelabeledo 4y ago

You can do the same with just cash.

JoeAltmaier 4y ago
It won't go in the floppy slot somehow...
Overtonwindow 4y ago
But then cash becomes a storage issue. The same way marijuana shops are blocked from depositing their cash into banks, cash with sex workers becomes a problem. How to get it into the banking system without drawing the attention of the police? Even worse, try paying bills with cash. If you'll pardon me, I think cash deposite below $1,000 should be none of the government's business without a valid, specific warrant. If someone wants to sell drugs, sex, or graphics cards on the side for cash, it's none of the government's business.
- CaptainZapp 4y ago
  > The same way marijuana shops are blocked from depositing their cash into banks, cash with sex workers becomes a problem. Only if sex work is illegal. Which it isn't in significant parts of the developed world. Prostitutes (male or female) here around are taxed like everybody else. In addition they need to be health checked to perform their work. Paying them in cash is really no problem neither for the client nor for the provider.
- philwelch 4y ago
  $10,000 is the threshold where you have to tell the bank where you got the money. Of course, if you make ten deposits of $1000 to avoid this rule, that’s called “structuring” and is considered a federal offense.
- dismantlethesun 4y ago
  The police don’t watch cash transactions without reason. If you simply regularly deposit cash, then you only have to declare a business account and no one will take a second look at you at the bank.
- JumpCrisscross 4y ago
  > someone wants to sell drugs, sex, or graphics cards on the side for cash, it's none of the government's business This is a valid opinion. But it's clearly in the minority. (Counterfactual: there is broad support for drug policy reform [1].) Particularly when one considers the tax consequences. [1] https://www.aclu.org/press-releases/50th-anniversary-war-drugs-poll-shows-majority-voters-support-ending-criminal https://www.aclu.org/press-releases/50th-anniversary-war-dru...
- wil421 4y ago
  You have a cookie baking or massage business that covers enough to pay a modest mortgage and car. The rest you pay in cash. You give family members down payments to buy property or leases for you.
  - lazide 4y ago
    Aka money laundering (according to the feds)
    - wil421 4y ago
      As long as sex working is illegal they will have to launder the money somehow.

kalleboo 4y ago

Typically technical solutions don't solve social problems

zivkovicp 4y ago

They do, but not if you use a commercial platform. Host your own infrastructure (ftp/email/www/etc.) and use Btc, and you will have a lot more liberty but not "reach"... so you can't have your cake and eat it too. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

SamoyedFurFluff 4y ago

Technology can’t solve primarily cultural issues. The second bitcoin tries to perform the same financial services as a bank (mortgages, lending, checking, savings, interest, etc) that institution using bitcoin will need to do the same “know your customer” behavior that makes it hard for sex workers to get the same financial services.

nannal 4y ago
Exchanges already do a decent amount of KYC. Some do not, but they typically have issues interfacing with the traditional banking environment.
from 4y ago
Exactly. Backpage took crypto for instance but ultimately if you are convicted of a crime and the government gives you a forfeiture order then it is a crime not to comply. Which is what they did to the tune of millions of dollars.

superkuh 4y ago

Bitcoin actually does play a big role in the online sex industry. Many sex workers and businsses online accept bitcoin and even prefer it. But then there's the problem that the US, and other, government are actively trying to regulate the Bitcoin to fiat gateways out of existence and make it too honerous for them to run their businesses the same way that sex worker businesses are attacked by the payment processors. So once you start working in cryptocurrency not only are the payment processors attacking you now you have the government attacking you too.

kobalsky 4y ago

yes, but for the regular person getting bitcoin is still high friction. I mean on a world when adding one extra step on your checkout will drop your conversion rate, getting people to buy btc before probably pushes you into being unprofitable. this will be true when and IF bitcoin gets to be ubiquitous

DennisP 4y ago

Cryptocurrency can't be a mass-market payment solution until it scales a lot better.

seydor 4y ago

It was, and then governments came