3 ms·

Especially the Rosetta stone was just a stone used for a wall when the French found it

adastra22 4y ago
To take another example, Greece wants the Parthenon marbles back. On the surface that seems fair--can you think of a more prominent symbol of Greece than images of the Parthenon? It's their national heritage and the want it back. But the parthenon marbles where lying all over the ground after being literally blown up in the 17th century when it was used as an ammunition storage depot. Nobody cared and it was not a recognized cultural artifact of note. Not until the British earl who bought them, legally, used them to help revive interest in Ancient Greece, and Athens specifically, and donated them to the British museum where they have been on prominent display since. "But they were bought from the Ottomans, not Greece!" Yeah, because Greece didn't exist, and hadn't existed as a nation or anything comparable since before the Roman Empire. The Byzantine Empire was the greek-speaking Roman Empire, and the Ottomans were the successors to Byzantine. But guess what? The 19th century revival in interest in greek origins was an essential part of gathering foreign support for greek nationalism, which would be achieved--with the support of British nationals--a few decades after the Parthenon marbles first went on display at the British Museum. The Parthenon became the symbol of Greece because it was on display at the British Museum for all to see. In an alternate history where the Parthenon marbles were not purchased from the Ottomans but instead were pilfered and reused for various building projects in 19th century Athens, no one but some academics would have cared about the relief sculptures, and greek nationalism might have been set back a few decades, or more. They only have widespread cultural value because of a British PR investment. Maybe they should be given back to Greece anyway. There's something to be said about having artifacts displayed in their original context. But the issue is hardly as clear-cut as it is made out to be.
- krapp 4y ago
  Greece can take the Parthenon marbles and pave roads with them if they want. Egypt can use the Rosetta Stone as a coffee table. The Imperial West is not entitled to the cultural wealth of other peoples, to steal their artifacts, or dig up their dead to put in little glass cases, or to grind up and eat, as the Victorians used to do to Egyptian mummies. Cultural exchange can be legitimately given between friends and allies, but not taken.
  - adastra22 4y ago
    I guess it's okay for you then that the Taliban and ISIS destroyed historical artifacts in Afghanistan and Iraq? It's not for me. These artifacts are the common heritage of mankind and need to be protected and preserved for the benefit of everyone alive today and into the future.

To take another example, Greece wants the Parthenon marbles back. On the surface that seems fair--can you think of a more prominent symbol of Greece than images of the Parthenon? It's their national heritage and the want it back. But the parthenon marbles where lying all over the ground after being literally blown up in the 17th century when it was used as an ammunition storage depot. Nobody cared and it was not a recognized cultural artifact of note. Not until the British earl who bought them, legally, used them to help revive interest in Ancient Greece, and Athens specifically, and donated them to the British museum where they have been on prominent display since. "But they were bought from the Ottomans, not Greece!" Yeah, because Greece didn't exist, and hadn't existed as a nation or anything comparable since before the Roman Empire. The Byzantine Empire was the greek-speaking Roman Empire, and the Ottomans were the successors to Byzantine. But guess what? The 19th century revival in interest in greek origins was an essential part of gathering foreign support for greek nationalism, which would be achieved--with the support of British nationals--a few decades after the Parthenon marbles first went on display at the British Museum. The Parthenon became the symbol of Greece because it was on display at the British Museum for all to see. In an alternate history where the Parthenon marbles were not purchased from the Ottomans but instead were pilfered and reused for various building projects in 19th century Athens, no one but some academics would have cared about the relief sculptures, and greek nationalism might have been set back a few decades, or more. They only have widespread cultural value because of a British PR investment. Maybe they should be given back to Greece anyway. There's something to be said about having artifacts displayed in their original context. But the issue is hardly as clear-cut as it is made out to be.

krapp 4y ago
Greece can take the Parthenon marbles and pave roads with them if they want. Egypt can use the Rosetta Stone as a coffee table. The Imperial West is not entitled to the cultural wealth of other peoples, to steal their artifacts, or dig up their dead to put in little glass cases, or to grind up and eat, as the Victorians used to do to Egyptian mummies. Cultural exchange can be legitimately given between friends and allies, but not taken.
- adastra22 4y ago
  I guess it's okay for you then that the Taliban and ISIS destroyed historical artifacts in Afghanistan and Iraq? It's not for me. These artifacts are the common heritage of mankind and need to be protected and preserved for the benefit of everyone alive today and into the future.