3 ms·

> while a well-made electric car can run to a million miles over 50+ years That is a big claim, which is completely unsupported by reality. ICEVs do not get r

> while a well-made electric car can run to a million miles over 50+ years That is a big claim, which is completely unsupported by reality. ICEVs do not get recycled because the engine died. Body rot, repairs that cost more than the value of the car, etc, this is why cars are taken off the road. If anything, the current batch of early generation EVs are probably going to have shorter than average lifespans compared to established ICEVs, not longer.

VBprogrammer 4y ago
There is a someone on YouTube who works driving HGVs for a large vehicle recycling company in the UK. I'm often surprised by the cars that are considered end of life. Cars which I still think of as recent models. It would be great to see some statistics but to me most of the cars he picks up require some kind of major repair work making it uneconomical to fix. Often not the engine admittedly, the vast majority can drag themselves onto the back of the truck under their own power (and it's so much faster to do that than get out the winch cable that there is a big incentive for him to try). Usually though they aren't running correctly or have obvious issues with the clutch or gearbox. Almost none of the modern cars suffer any appreciable rot. On the other hand I've been watching the price of 1st generation Nissan Leafs as I want one as a run around and over the last couple of years there prices appear to have increased. There are a couple of companies who will swap a 40kwh battery pack into a 24kwh leaf making it a very usable vehicle indeed, though the people doing this seem to be doing it for sentimental reason as you can buy a 5 year newer car with a 40kwh battery pack for the same net cost. The price for a full 24kwh battery appears to be in the £2-4k range as even with 20% degradation it's still a huge amount of stationary storage.
- greedo 4y ago
  I live in the Midwest (US) and all I see is cars rotting. Cars under 5 years where the owner doesn't take care of the paint (wash/wax etc) and the wheel wells start to rust off. I even play a game with my kids where we watch for "Pavement Princess" trucks that have rust.
  - VBprogrammer 4y ago
    I've had a good look around my local area and very few of the cars have any visible rust. We have a fairly mild climate in South East England but we do use salt on the roads in winter time. Of the two vehicles with any noticeable rust, one is a '05 Mercedes Sprinter, these seem to be predisposed to rust. The other was a T registered (1999) Land Rover Discovery but even that has obviously been modified for off-road use so it's hardly fair to include it. I wonder if this is climate related or US cars are not built with the same rust treatment.
restore_creole_ 4y ago
For the million mile mark there is at least one example. https://insideevs.com/news/559261/tesla-models-p85-1500000-kilometers/ https://insideevs.com/news/559261/tesla-models-p85-1500000-k...
- VBprogrammer 4y ago
  With multiple battery and drive unit replacements we may as well call it Triggers Tesla! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus
  - restore_creole_ 4y ago
    It is normal for a car with that many miles to need to have some replacement parts. There are users who have reported going over 500,000 km on original battery (20% degradation). https://twitter.com/IovePianoBlack/status/1551585557746262018?cxt=HHwWhIC9gYO2q4grAAAA https://twitter.com/IovePianoBlack/status/155158555774626201...
    - VBprogrammer 4y ago
      There is a big difference between some replacement parts and having all of the major components replaced multiple times.
      - samatman 4y ago
        I think you read the engine part wrong. The battery pack was recalled and its replacement has logged 1,000,000 km. Similarly, three of the four motors were all recalled at the same time, the fourth one wasn't and made it to 1,000,000 km, possibly 1,500,000 as well, the article says they don't know. Parts which are recalled and replaced by the manufacturer say something about reliability, but nothing about durability: reliability tends to improve. Regardless, my point is the engines were 3/4 replaced once, not replaced three different times. The battery was also replaced twice, but that's because the interim was a loaner, not because it failed twice.

VBprogrammer 4y ago

There is a someone on YouTube who works driving HGVs for a large vehicle recycling company in the UK. I'm often surprised by the cars that are considered end of life. Cars which I still think of as recent models. It would be great to see some statistics but to me most of the cars he picks up require some kind of major repair work making it uneconomical to fix. Often not the engine admittedly, the vast majority can drag themselves onto the back of the truck under their own power (and it's so much faster to do that than get out the winch cable that there is a big incentive for him to try). Usually though they aren't running correctly or have obvious issues with the clutch or gearbox. Almost none of the modern cars suffer any appreciable rot. On the other hand I've been watching the price of 1st generation Nissan Leafs as I want one as a run around and over the last couple of years there prices appear to have increased. There are a couple of companies who will swap a 40kwh battery pack into a 24kwh leaf making it a very usable vehicle indeed, though the people doing this seem to be doing it for sentimental reason as you can buy a 5 year newer car with a 40kwh battery pack for the same net cost. The price for a full 24kwh battery appears to be in the £2-4k range as even with 20% degradation it's still a huge amount of stationary storage.

greedo 4y ago
I live in the Midwest (US) and all I see is cars rotting. Cars under 5 years where the owner doesn't take care of the paint (wash/wax etc) and the wheel wells start to rust off. I even play a game with my kids where we watch for "Pavement Princess" trucks that have rust.
- VBprogrammer 4y ago
  I've had a good look around my local area and very few of the cars have any visible rust. We have a fairly mild climate in South East England but we do use salt on the roads in winter time. Of the two vehicles with any noticeable rust, one is a '05 Mercedes Sprinter, these seem to be predisposed to rust. The other was a T registered (1999) Land Rover Discovery but even that has obviously been modified for off-road use so it's hardly fair to include it. I wonder if this is climate related or US cars are not built with the same rust treatment.

restore_creole_ 4y ago

For the million mile mark there is at least one example. https://insideevs.com/news/559261/tesla-models-p85-1500000-kilometers/ https://insideevs.com/news/559261/tesla-models-p85-1500000-k...

VBprogrammer 4y ago
With multiple battery and drive unit replacements we may as well call it Triggers Tesla! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus
- restore_creole_ 4y ago
  It is normal for a car with that many miles to need to have some replacement parts. There are users who have reported going over 500,000 km on original battery (20% degradation). https://twitter.com/IovePianoBlack/status/1551585557746262018?cxt=HHwWhIC9gYO2q4grAAAA https://twitter.com/IovePianoBlack/status/155158555774626201...
  - VBprogrammer 4y ago
    There is a big difference between some replacement parts and having all of the major components replaced multiple times.
    - samatman 4y ago
      I think you read the engine part wrong. The battery pack was recalled and its replacement has logged 1,000,000 km. Similarly, three of the four motors were all recalled at the same time, the fourth one wasn't and made it to 1,000,000 km, possibly 1,500,000 as well, the article says they don't know. Parts which are recalled and replaced by the manufacturer say something about reliability, but nothing about durability: reliability tends to improve. Regardless, my point is the engines were 3/4 replaced once, not replaced three different times. The battery was also replaced twice, but that's because the interim was a loaner, not because it failed twice.