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In Europe, everybody has a long history of being invaded by everybody else, so trying to spin that as "Russia bad" requires a very myopic outlook. Russia also

In Europe, everybody has a long history of being invaded by everybody else, so trying to spin that as "Russia bad" requires a very myopic outlook. Russia also has a long history of being invaded from the West. That's why Russia is super nervious about NATO expansion.

macintux 4y ago
Last time Russia was invaded: the time they helped a genocidal maniac try to conquer Europe, 80 years ago. Last time Russia’s neighbors were invaded by them: well, obviously, now.
- thriftwy 4y ago
  That genocidal maniac is who unites the EU today. If you no longer blame Germany for Hitler you can't in any kind of good faith blame Russia for Soviet Union's pact with Hitler.
  - macintux 4y ago
    I’m fine blaming the current genocidal maniac: Putin.
MichaelCollins 4y ago
Most of Europe lost their taste for war a few generations ago, and have since tried to create a world where constant invasions of their neighbors is no longer the status quo. They are weary of Russia because Russia never got with the program. Russia does not believe that a peaceful future is possible, assumes the old status quo will continue, and act accordingly by continuing to invade their neighbors. And just to preempt the inevitable whataboutism; America never got with the program either. Not really. But America isn't the one threatening Western Europe with war, and Eastern European countries like Poland and Ukraine choosing to align themselves with America/NATO to protect themselves against Russia speaks volumes about the relative threat of America vs Russia to peace in Europe.
- thriftwy 4y ago
  Few generations is not enough. Having a few generations between large-scale war is how Europe operated in the last 200+ years. Maybe it's just few generations o'clock. Add to that how Europe absolutely botched both Bosnia and Kosovo and had full-scale wars there. Your arguments about world peace are bogus. Europe is encircled in a ring of fire made from ex-USSR, Middle East and Maghreb. All the wars in the world happen around Europe specifically. Maybe it's time to ask why. As you can see now, not all of Ukraine wants to align itself with America/NATO.
  - orangepurple 4y ago
    Not sure if all the wars in the world happen around Europe, unless you literally mean AROUND not IN. See https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_confli...
    - thriftwy 4y ago
      Most of these wars do not happen in core Europe, but they come dangerously close to it: Cyprus, Bosnia, now Ukraine. Meanwhile, East Asia or Americas just don't see that amount of action. Africa does, but that's another story. It's like someone is throwing wars towards Europe.

macintux 4y ago

Last time Russia was invaded: the time they helped a genocidal maniac try to conquer Europe, 80 years ago. Last time Russia’s neighbors were invaded by them: well, obviously, now.

thriftwy 4y ago
That genocidal maniac is who unites the EU today. If you no longer blame Germany for Hitler you can't in any kind of good faith blame Russia for Soviet Union's pact with Hitler.
- macintux 4y ago
  I’m fine blaming the current genocidal maniac: Putin.

MichaelCollins 4y ago

Most of Europe lost their taste for war a few generations ago, and have since tried to create a world where constant invasions of their neighbors is no longer the status quo. They are weary of Russia because Russia never got with the program. Russia does not believe that a peaceful future is possible, assumes the old status quo will continue, and act accordingly by continuing to invade their neighbors. And just to preempt the inevitable whataboutism; America never got with the program either. Not really. But America isn't the one threatening Western Europe with war, and Eastern European countries like Poland and Ukraine choosing to align themselves with America/NATO to protect themselves against Russia speaks volumes about the relative threat of America vs Russia to peace in Europe.

thriftwy 4y ago
Few generations is not enough. Having a few generations between large-scale war is how Europe operated in the last 200+ years. Maybe it's just few generations o'clock. Add to that how Europe absolutely botched both Bosnia and Kosovo and had full-scale wars there. Your arguments about world peace are bogus. Europe is encircled in a ring of fire made from ex-USSR, Middle East and Maghreb. All the wars in the world happen around Europe specifically. Maybe it's time to ask why. As you can see now, not all of Ukraine wants to align itself with America/NATO.
- orangepurple 4y ago
  Not sure if all the wars in the world happen around Europe, unless you literally mean AROUND not IN. See https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_conflicts https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ongoing_armed_confli...
  - thriftwy 4y ago
    Most of these wars do not happen in core Europe, but they come dangerously close to it: Cyprus, Bosnia, now Ukraine. Meanwhile, East Asia or Americas just don't see that amount of action. Africa does, but that's another story. It's like someone is throwing wars towards Europe.