3 ms·

I'd add that many people go vegan/ vegetarian due to awareness of impact of meat consumption on global warming and hunger. Worrying too much about the future a

by lytefm 4y ago

I'd add that many people go vegan/ vegetarian due to awareness of impact of meat consumption on global warming and hunger. Worrying too much about the future and the state of the world in general can definitely lead to depression. Ignorance is bliss. Also, I've found esoteric or conspiracy theorist views to be quite common among some vegans and vegetarian: If you're convinced that this this the only healthy and ethical way of eating, some evil force must be working against it!

denton-scratch 4y ago
> Worrying too much about the future and the state of the world in general can definitely lead to depression. Doing "too much" of anything leads to adverse consequences, almost by definition. Arguably "worrying too much" is a symptom of depression, rather than a cause. And what is "depression"? Are you just saying that worrying about the state of the world makes you fed-up? Maybe being fed-up about the state of the world makes you fed-up. I try to avoid the vernacular use of the word "depression", because it can mean either being fed-up or being clinically depressed, and I'm not a clinician. FTR, I was once diagnosed with depression, and prescribed antidepressants. They had a really odd effect on me, and I discontinued their use after 6 months. I'm much happier now, because I'm not ill; I just have lots of reasons to be fed-up.
- lytefm 4y ago
  > Arguably "worrying too much" is a symptom of depression, rather than a cause. Well, it's not like you're suddenly getting a depression out of the blue and then start having obsessive negative thoughts. Repetitive intrusive thoughts can in fact lead into depression. > Are you just saying that worrying about the state of the world makes you fed-up? Most people will probably just feel fed up and not bother much. But for some, it can contribute to anxiety, depressive episodes or a full depression. I agree, the term "depression" is probably used inflationary when it's "only" a depressive episode or feeling depressed.
  - denton-scratch 4y ago
    > But for some, it can contribute to anxiety Being anxious isn't the same as being ill. It's rational (and healthy) to be anxious in the face of serious threats.
- lytefm 4y ago
  And great if you're feeling better! > I'm much happier now, because I'm not ill; I just have lots of reasons to be fed-up. Reminds me of what Jordan Peterson often mentions in his Podcasts: When a patient comes in and tells they are depressed, he asks how the life is going. If things are going fine but the person feels depressed - might be a depressive episode or depression then. But let's say they're a young adult, have no friends, no job and spend their whole day playing computer games and watching porn - then life just sucks and they need to work on that instead of getting meds.
  - denton-scratch 4y ago
    I should have added a smiley or something; what I was trying to imply was that being diagnosed and treated for depression made things worse for me, and that my rejection of that diagnosis in itself improved my mood. Let me put it another way: if you have some cause to be fed-up, and then some shrink diagnoses you with depression, you now have two reasons to be fed-up. Like as not, your original cause of fed-upness could be remedied; but depression is uncurable, all they can do is treat the symptoms. And reportedly, the treatment can be worse than the disease: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antidepressants_and_suicide_risk https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antidepressants_and_suicide_ri... I don't mean to suggest that depression doesn't exist. But it's wildly over-diagnosed; I suspect that depression is often diagnosed because it's massively cheaper to write a scrip for a bottle of some shifty "mood-regulator" than to look closely into their life circumstances, history of trauma, relationships with others etc.
wyager 4y ago
> Worrying too much about the future and the state of the world in general can definitely lead to depression. Ignorance is bliss. What is your procedure for distinguishing between neuroticism and awareness? Accurately calibrated concern and ignorance? > I've found esoteric or conspiracy theorist views to be quite common among some vegans and vegetarian This would lend credence to the "heightened irrational neuroticism" theory.
- lytefm 4y ago
  > What is your procedure for distinguishing between neuroticism and awareness? Accurately calibrated concern and ignorance? I'm not a psychologist, but AFAIK neuroticism is a personality trait. So my hypothesis would be that people for people who score high on that trait and maybe have some other problem in life, diving too deep into what's going wrong in the world could lead to anxiety, helplessness and depression. And yeah, if such a person then walks into conspiracy theory territory, we'd have "heightened irrational neuroticism". On the other hand, if someone is mentally stable and well informed, has a positive outlook on the future and adopts a vegan/ vegetarian diet for good reasons, that's great.

by lytefm 4y ago

denton-scratch 4y ago

> Worrying too much about the future and the state of the world in general can definitely lead to depression. Doing "too much" of anything leads to adverse consequences, almost by definition. Arguably "worrying too much" is a symptom of depression, rather than a cause. And what is "depression"? Are you just saying that worrying about the state of the world makes you fed-up? Maybe being fed-up about the state of the world makes you fed-up. I try to avoid the vernacular use of the word "depression", because it can mean either being fed-up or being clinically depressed, and I'm not a clinician. FTR, I was once diagnosed with depression, and prescribed antidepressants. They had a really odd effect on me, and I discontinued their use after 6 months. I'm much happier now, because I'm not ill; I just have lots of reasons to be fed-up.

lytefm 4y ago
> Arguably "worrying too much" is a symptom of depression, rather than a cause. Well, it's not like you're suddenly getting a depression out of the blue and then start having obsessive negative thoughts. Repetitive intrusive thoughts can in fact lead into depression. > Are you just saying that worrying about the state of the world makes you fed-up? Most people will probably just feel fed up and not bother much. But for some, it can contribute to anxiety, depressive episodes or a full depression. I agree, the term "depression" is probably used inflationary when it's "only" a depressive episode or feeling depressed.
- denton-scratch 4y ago
  > But for some, it can contribute to anxiety Being anxious isn't the same as being ill. It's rational (and healthy) to be anxious in the face of serious threats.
lytefm 4y ago
And great if you're feeling better! > I'm much happier now, because I'm not ill; I just have lots of reasons to be fed-up. Reminds me of what Jordan Peterson often mentions in his Podcasts: When a patient comes in and tells they are depressed, he asks how the life is going. If things are going fine but the person feels depressed - might be a depressive episode or depression then. But let's say they're a young adult, have no friends, no job and spend their whole day playing computer games and watching porn - then life just sucks and they need to work on that instead of getting meds.
- denton-scratch 4y ago
  I should have added a smiley or something; what I was trying to imply was that being diagnosed and treated for depression made things worse for me, and that my rejection of that diagnosis in itself improved my mood. Let me put it another way: if you have some cause to be fed-up, and then some shrink diagnoses you with depression, you now have two reasons to be fed-up. Like as not, your original cause of fed-upness could be remedied; but depression is uncurable, all they can do is treat the symptoms. And reportedly, the treatment can be worse than the disease: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antidepressants_and_suicide_risk https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antidepressants_and_suicide_ri... I don't mean to suggest that depression doesn't exist. But it's wildly over-diagnosed; I suspect that depression is often diagnosed because it's massively cheaper to write a scrip for a bottle of some shifty "mood-regulator" than to look closely into their life circumstances, history of trauma, relationships with others etc.

wyager 4y ago

> Worrying too much about the future and the state of the world in general can definitely lead to depression. Ignorance is bliss. What is your procedure for distinguishing between neuroticism and awareness? Accurately calibrated concern and ignorance? > I've found esoteric or conspiracy theorist views to be quite common among some vegans and vegetarian This would lend credence to the "heightened irrational neuroticism" theory.

lytefm 4y ago
> What is your procedure for distinguishing between neuroticism and awareness? Accurately calibrated concern and ignorance? I'm not a psychologist, but AFAIK neuroticism is a personality trait. So my hypothesis would be that people for people who score high on that trait and maybe have some other problem in life, diving too deep into what's going wrong in the world could lead to anxiety, helplessness and depression. And yeah, if such a person then walks into conspiracy theory territory, we'd have "heightened irrational neuroticism". On the other hand, if someone is mentally stable and well informed, has a positive outlook on the future and adopts a vegan/ vegetarian diet for good reasons, that's great.