5 ms·

Some options: 1. Nobody is reading your WA messages, the same topics can be learned from your browsing activity or other msgs, eg. by reading your sms texts.

• elondaits 4y ago
  Another option would be that META created a small model that could be run client-side and picked the right selection of ads to show elsewhere without even exfiltrating keywords.
  • Maro 4y ago
    Yes, this is a bit similar to my 3. option, but more sophisticated..
  • rreyes1979 4y ago
    Well, my wife sent me a picture of my daughter working on a puzzle. Less than 24 hours later, her Instagram was showing ads for a store that was selling the same type of puzzle as the one my daughter was playing with. So it's not just terms but images too.
    • bin_bash 4y ago
      That doesn’t even make sense. Why go through the trouble of retargeting based on images? If you took a photo of something you likely already own it.
      • g8oz 4y ago
        Mindlessly retargeting you based on things you own or have already bought is standard practice in the online ad industry.
      • martin_a 4y ago
        > If you took a photo of something you likely already own it. Tell that to Amazon who never fail to recommend me things I just bought.
        • pc86 4y ago
          Hey if you really liked the vacuum cleaner you just bought, you definitely want to buy another one.
          • martin_a 4y ago
            Yes, for sure. Now I've got a different vacuum cleaner for every room. Never have I felt cleaner before.
            • bombcar 4y ago
              Wait until you find out about whole home vacuums! Then you can turn The Whole House into a vacuum!
          • quesera 4y ago
            You have to believe that Amazon's algorithm is working as intended though, right? The thesis is that recent vacuum cleaner purchasers are many times more likely (than the average person) to be looking to buy a vacuum cleaner. Apparently about 20% of Amazon purchases are returned. And most returners are looking for a replacement. Some of the replacement product research is done before the return decision is made, so you get ads even if you have not initiated a return. As much as Amazon doesn't want you to return your purchase, they really don't want you to buy the replacement somewhere else. It would be interesting to measure how the ad ratio changes over time. Particularly when you exit the return window, but of course Amazon will know the return-likelihood curve with much greater precision.
      • viraptor 4y ago
        Looking through my photos, that's not the case. It's either things I don't own but like, places I enjoyed, or photos of things I want to buy / sent to my wife to buy. In my case, the photos would be a prefect targeting opportunity.
    • Maro 4y ago
      Assuming Android: your pictures may be "parsed" by Google once they make it into Google Photos. Also, Meta may think that "parsing" the images in your local Whatsapp folder of Google Photos (or all of your local images) is fair game. Note that I have no clue if this happens, I'm speculating.
    • siilats 4y ago
      Where did your daughter get the puzzle and when if she was just working on it :)
• GuB-42 4y ago
  If 2 is true, then it is not end-to-end encrypted, and I don't think that WhatsApp is lying. They have ways of doing their things without lying, so I don't expect 2 to be true. I think that 1 is the most plausible, however the original post is about "topics they never talk about", so assuming that WhatsApp is the only channel and they don't leak data in other ways (and there are many other ways to leak data), then 1 becomes unlikely. 3 is the most compatible. All the targeting can be done locally, so no end-to-end unencrypted message leaves the app. The app then sends your topics of interests to Meta. 4 again assuming WhatsApp is the only channel, then there is probably some malware somewhere, and it is unlikely that Meta accepts illegally collected data (they can do it legally, better, and with less potential trouble). There are however a few legitimate apps that can do the above. I am thinking about things like predictive keyboards, accessibility apps (screen readers, ...), backup apps (end-to-end encryption is about transmission, not storage), and the OS itself. I don't think Meta controls any of these, and I don't think they would buy data from them (Google and Apple are competitors after all). So I would go for an accidental leak (case 1). For example, for the experiment to be meaningful, you shouldn't tell anyone about the test topic before you receive the ads. Or with the WhatsApp app hinting Meta about your topics of interest.
  • mid-kid 4y ago
    Another thing that would make 1 happen even if they think they're not leaking information over different channels, is the software keyboard. GBoard is google's, and likely has some data collection in one way or another. Similarly, there's a lot of google-related services running with root privileges on stock android phones that could easily snoop on data from various apps. This effect is worsened by other android OEMs, like xiaomi or maybe even samsung, who ship their own invasive services on top.
  • Maro 4y ago
    Disclaimer: I worked at FB, but not on Whatsapp or ads. I agree, I'm pretty sure 2. is not the case; I just listed it as a theoretical possibility. Despite all the bad press and problems, FB has very (very) high integrity and standards, at least the parts I saw.