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>You make it sound like truth wasn't a game until now, all of a sudden, or that people weren't championing the goals they value until now, all of a sudden. My

>You make it sound like truth wasn't a game until now, all of a sudden, or that people weren't championing the goals they value until now, all of a sudden. My intention was to make it sound like objective reality was always at least part of the game until now. There has never been a period of time where the explicit rejection of objective reality in lieu of ideology has been a significant part of the United States "establishment". >'Post-modernism' is one of the most over-used keywords to describe the current landscape, particularly if you think only a certain party can be accused of it. Unfortunately rampant partisanship combined with a lack of education and critical thinking skills has left people unable to have any understanding of society outside of the false, contrived Republican vs Democratic binary narrative. As an example of the delusional brain-rot that has infected our institutions, I point you to a recent article from The Atlantic, which has been widely regarded as the voice of the DC Establishment for decades. > And though sex differences in sports show advantages for men, researchers today still don’t know how much of this to attribute to biological difference versus the lack of support provided to women athletes to reach their highest potential. https://www.theatlantic.com/culture/archive/2022/09/sports-gender-sex-segregation-coed/671460/ https://www.theatlantic.com/culture/archive/2022/09/sports-g...

inkcapmushroom 4y ago
>There has never been a period of time where the explicit rejection of objective reality in lieu of ideology has been a significant part of the United States "establishment". The whole point is that objective reality ends very quickly past mathematical theorems. Slaves were not people according to the establishment, and it was common sense and objective fact that whites were superior. Until it wasn't. According to the mainstream homosexual people were objectively, factually mentally ill and evil, and then they weren't. Back when those ideas were mainstream, there were always people who rejected those "objective realities", but most people had a harder time spreading ideas which went against the mainstream then we do today. In other words, minority voices are louder now then any other time in history, and our sense of an objective reality relies on having a stable narrative grounded in the majority voice.
- StanislavPetrov 4y ago
  >The whole point is that objective reality ends very quickly past mathematical theorems. In fact that's completely false. If a rock is flying through the air towards your head, and you don't move, that rock will hit you in the head. That is objective reality. Various people can come up with all sorts of narratives and beliefs about what that rock is, who threw it, whether or not the rock is sentient or represents something else entirely. But objective reality is the rock hitting you in the head. Reasonable people can argue about the meaning of the rock, why it was thrown, who threw it, or how it was otherwise ejected through the sky towards your head, but they all agree that the rock is there, flying through the sky towards your head. That is objective reality.
  - AnimalMuppet 4y ago
    In fact, you could say that this is more objective than mathematics. The rock is really there, whether or not you accept the axiom of choice, whether or not you like ZFC as an axiomatic basis, or whatever. It's even there if you think 2+2=5.

inkcapmushroom 4y ago

>There has never been a period of time where the explicit rejection of objective reality in lieu of ideology has been a significant part of the United States "establishment". The whole point is that objective reality ends very quickly past mathematical theorems. Slaves were not people according to the establishment, and it was common sense and objective fact that whites were superior. Until it wasn't. According to the mainstream homosexual people were objectively, factually mentally ill and evil, and then they weren't. Back when those ideas were mainstream, there were always people who rejected those "objective realities", but most people had a harder time spreading ideas which went against the mainstream then we do today. In other words, minority voices are louder now then any other time in history, and our sense of an objective reality relies on having a stable narrative grounded in the majority voice.

StanislavPetrov 4y ago
>The whole point is that objective reality ends very quickly past mathematical theorems. In fact that's completely false. If a rock is flying through the air towards your head, and you don't move, that rock will hit you in the head. That is objective reality. Various people can come up with all sorts of narratives and beliefs about what that rock is, who threw it, whether or not the rock is sentient or represents something else entirely. But objective reality is the rock hitting you in the head. Reasonable people can argue about the meaning of the rock, why it was thrown, who threw it, or how it was otherwise ejected through the sky towards your head, but they all agree that the rock is there, flying through the sky towards your head. That is objective reality.
- AnimalMuppet 4y ago
  In fact, you could say that this is more objective than mathematics. The rock is really there, whether or not you accept the axiom of choice, whether or not you like ZFC as an axiomatic basis, or whatever. It's even there if you think 2+2=5.