4 ms·

What does silverblue give you on top of what Guix and Nix already provide?

bogwog 4y ago
In Guix's case, a working desktop with wayland + proprietary Nvidia drivers. (I'm actually using Kinoite, which is the KDE spin of silverblue) I could install Guix on top of something like Ubuntu or Fedora workstation for the same effect, but then I'll have two system package managers side by side, which is pointless and probably error prone.
- von_lohengramm 4y ago
  You can do that with NixOS trivially.
  - rekado 4y ago
    And of course with Guix System. (odd to always see Nix* mentioned when someone talks about Guix.)
    - striking 4y ago
      Comparing https://wiki.systemcrafters.cc/guix/nvidia/ https://wiki.systemcrafters.cc/guix/nvidia/ with https://nixos.wiki/wiki/Nvidia https://nixos.wiki/wiki/Nvidia makes me think that in this specific case there's a difference.
      - pxc 4y ago
        A question for nonguix contributors, including OP: is there a reason that nonguix has an nvidia package but not an nvidia service that handles more of this in a streamlined way, even just some stuff copied and pasted from this wiki?
        podiki 4y ago
        There's an ongoing effort to smooth out the entire Nvidia process, e.g. https://gitlab.com/nonguix/nonguix/-/issues/198 https://gitlab.com/nonguix/nonguix/-/issues/198 has the current discussion. As anyone that has dealt with Nvidia on Linux, it is always a bit of a hassle and the effort hasn't yet happened to make it as smooth in Guix as other distros. We're getting there though.
    - RaitoBezarius 4y ago
      Well, Guix is also mentioned when someone talks about Nix, seems fair to me (and of course, Guix may be more relevant sometimes!).
    - von_lohengramm 4y ago
      Well, Nix was mentioned a few posts up... But in general, Guix is directly based off of Nix and is seen by many as "Nix + Guile + GNU". Is it odd to see people talking about a different BSD in a {Free,Open,Net,*}BSD thread?
      - podiki 4y ago
        Guix is quite different from it's origins, though some of the oldest part of the daemon are still from the Nix days, if I understand. It will one day be rewritten in all Guile, presumably.
pxc 4y ago
An FHS base system that still gives you some of the nice features of Nix and Guix, like immutability and rollbacks. In theory something like it could be a giant escape hatch so that if you run into Guix packaging difficulties for some software that, e.g., tries to fetch from the internet at runtime, you can just build with autoconf and make or `npm build` or whatever against the Fedora base system. Silverblue might be quirky enough that it has its own hiccups though, idk.
- nextos 4y ago
  Nix provides FHS environment sandboxes, which are also a great escape hatch, or an alternative for quick packaging: https://nixos.org/manual/nixpkgs/stable/#sec-fhs-environments https://nixos.org/manual/nixpkgs/stable/#sec-fhs-environment...
  - pxc 4y ago
    I think nonguix also uses equivalent machinery for its Steam package: https://gitlab.com/nonguix/nonguix/-/blob/master/nongnu/packages/steam-client.scm#L392 https://gitlab.com/nonguix/nonguix/-/blob/master/nongnu/pack... Maybe there are docs on repurposing that as a general packaging escape hatch, which someone more familiar with nonguix could point to in a reply. Apparently there is an rpm-ostree-friendly RPM build of Nix that can be used to install Nix on Silverblue as well: https://github.com/nix-community/nix-installers/pull/8 https://github.com/nix-community/nix-installers/pull/8 It includes some code to get around the group/user management quirks that some other commenters have noted b0rked the Guix installer with Silverblue, so perhaps it gives an outline of how to install Guix on Silverblue for a hacker who'd like to try it :)
    - podiki 4y ago
      See my comment above about adding a general FHS container to Guix itself; it works, just need to put the final touches on the patches.
      - pxc 4y ago

In Guix's case, a working desktop with wayland + proprietary Nvidia drivers. (I'm actually using Kinoite, which is the KDE spin of silverblue) I could install Guix on top of something like Ubuntu or Fedora workstation for the same effect, but then I'll have two system package managers side by side, which is pointless and probably error prone.

von_lohengramm 4y ago
You can do that with NixOS trivially.
- rekado 4y ago
  And of course with Guix System. (odd to always see Nix* mentioned when someone talks about Guix.)
  - striking 4y ago
    Comparing https://wiki.systemcrafters.cc/guix/nvidia/ https://wiki.systemcrafters.cc/guix/nvidia/ with https://nixos.wiki/wiki/Nvidia https://nixos.wiki/wiki/Nvidia makes me think that in this specific case there's a difference.
    - pxc 4y ago
      A question for nonguix contributors, including OP: is there a reason that nonguix has an nvidia package but not an nvidia service that handles more of this in a streamlined way, even just some stuff copied and pasted from this wiki?
      - podiki 4y ago
        There's an ongoing effort to smooth out the entire Nvidia process, e.g. https://gitlab.com/nonguix/nonguix/-/issues/198 https://gitlab.com/nonguix/nonguix/-/issues/198 has the current discussion. As anyone that has dealt with Nvidia on Linux, it is always a bit of a hassle and the effort hasn't yet happened to make it as smooth in Guix as other distros. We're getting there though.
  - RaitoBezarius 4y ago
    Well, Guix is also mentioned when someone talks about Nix, seems fair to me (and of course, Guix may be more relevant sometimes!).
  - von_lohengramm 4y ago
    Well, Nix was mentioned a few posts up... But in general, Guix is directly based off of Nix and is seen by many as "Nix + Guile + GNU". Is it odd to see people talking about a different BSD in a {Free,Open,Net,*}BSD thread?
    - podiki 4y ago
      Guix is quite different from it's origins, though some of the oldest part of the daemon are still from the Nix days, if I understand. It will one day be rewritten in all Guile, presumably.

pxc 4y ago

An FHS base system that still gives you some of the nice features of Nix and Guix, like immutability and rollbacks. In theory something like it could be a giant escape hatch so that if you run into Guix packaging difficulties for some software that, e.g., tries to fetch from the internet at runtime, you can just build with autoconf and make or `npm build` or whatever against the Fedora base system. Silverblue might be quirky enough that it has its own hiccups though, idk.

nextos 4y ago
Nix provides FHS environment sandboxes, which are also a great escape hatch, or an alternative for quick packaging: https://nixos.org/manual/nixpkgs/stable/#sec-fhs-environments https://nixos.org/manual/nixpkgs/stable/#sec-fhs-environment...
- pxc 4y ago
  I think nonguix also uses equivalent machinery for its Steam package: https://gitlab.com/nonguix/nonguix/-/blob/master/nongnu/packages/steam-client.scm#L392 https://gitlab.com/nonguix/nonguix/-/blob/master/nongnu/pack... Maybe there are docs on repurposing that as a general packaging escape hatch, which someone more familiar with nonguix could point to in a reply. Apparently there is an rpm-ostree-friendly RPM build of Nix that can be used to install Nix on Silverblue as well: https://github.com/nix-community/nix-installers/pull/8 https://github.com/nix-community/nix-installers/pull/8 It includes some code to get around the group/user management quirks that some other commenters have noted b0rked the Guix installer with Silverblue, so perhaps it gives an outline of how to install Guix on Silverblue for a hacker who'd like to try it :)
  - podiki 4y ago
    See my comment above about adding a general FHS container to Guix itself; it works, just need to put the final touches on the patches.
    - pxc 4y ago