6 ms·
(As the father of a teenage boy, this is the first thing that popped into my head) Any family with the ability to send their teenage boys abroad to live with ex
by Kon-Peki 4y ago
(As the father of a teenage boy, this is the first thing that popped into my head) Any family with the ability to send their teenage boys abroad to live with extended family/friends is going to do so, ASAP. Russia's already terrible demographics are going to get worse. A lot worse.
How long before they start selling territory to China?
- 11235813213455 4y agoor open more their immigration doors
- pohl 4y agoI think just yesterday they passed legislation that would allow foreigners to sign contracts for 1 year of military service in exchange for citizenship eligibility.
- hef19898 4y agoBetter then the French with 5 years, or the UK which doesn't hrant citizenship to, e.g., the Gurkhas. Not that I would take that particular offer so...
- hef19898 4y agoAnd THAT is the main reason there were so many young men among the refugees from Arab countries, they didn't want to fight for what ever side shanghaied them first.
- khazhoux 4y ago> shanghaied Nit: We can probably retire this term now.
- hef19898 4y agoI know, the actual naval practice doesn't exist anymore (mostly that is...), it still describes the practice very well, doesn't it?
- dredmorbius 4y agoImpressed?
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 4y agoWhy do you think it should be retired?
- riffic 4y agoit's kind of obvious.
- throwawayx134ax 4y agoOnly to those who are looking for excuses to take offense. That's sort of like saying a "pyrrhic victory" is offensive to the greeks.
- khazhoux 4y agoAssociating an entire city with a specific crime (from nearly 200 years ago) just seems unnecessary.
- SauciestGNU 4y agoPlus it was largely Europeans kidnapping other Europeans for voyages to the East. The people of Shanghai were not involved.
- Markoff 4y agobecause it has nothing to do with present day China for at least last few decades, you are MUCH more likely to get drugged and robbed in Manila for instance I had to look it up because this is first time I heard this nonsense term, so it's not like it's commonly used
- rendall 4y agoWhy would we do that?
- khazhoux 4y agoSeems to me an entire city doesn't need to be associated with the practice of kidnapping.
- ALittleLight 4y agoYou are free to use whichever terms you prefer.
- khazhoux 4y agoOf course I am. My point is that others should stop using the name of a Chinese city as shorthand for kidnapping and forced servitude.
- ALittleLight 4y agoOdd that you recognize a freedom for yourself that you don't extend to others.
- khazhoux 4y agoEveryone is of course free to use antiquated, offensive terms.
- booleandilemma 4y agoI can't be the only one getting tired of the language policing.
- zen_1 4y agoAnd everyone* is likewise free to complain about inconsequential choices of verbiage while men are being drafted against their will and forced to invade their neighbours. *everyone but those poor souls being drafted or invaded...
- jazzyjackson 4y agoit's descriptive, carries a lot of connotation, none of which actually involves the city or the people of shanghai, I don't get why anyone has beef with it.
- rPlayer6554 4y agoI have no idea what that term means.
- a_t48 4y agoI prefer press-ganging.
- morelisp 4y agoIt's not at all descriptive, it's purely allusive. You could learn everything there is to learn about the actual city and not have a clue what it meant.
- yongjik 4y ago> You could learn everything there is to learn about the actual city and not have a clue what it meant. I don't think that's what "descriptive" means. The term is as descriptive as much as "laconic" or "china" or "japan" (meaning varnish) - in each case, you can't independently derive the word's meaning from the original place name.
- colinmhayes 4y agoIt's literally the opposite of descriptive. Obviously it's not a big deal, but it's an easy thing to fix.
- SauciestGNU 4y agoMaybe "kidnapped into servitude/slavery" is more accurate?
- morelisp 4y ago
- layer8 4y agoLike “debunking”? https://blogs.lib.unc.edu/ncm/2022/01/14/zimmer/ https://blogs.lib.unc.edu/ncm/2022/01/14/zimmer/
- khazhoux 4y agoMy point wasn't etymological. The expression "to shanghai someone" doesn't just derive from the city name -- it is the city name. And the term originated at a time when respect by the West for Chinese people was not at a historical high point.
- neilv 4y agoAgreed. I've had some nice colleagues in Shanghai, and I suspect they'd prefer that the name of their home not be used to refer to an awful practice. FWIW, according to https://wordhistories.net/2019/07/16/shanghai-kidnap/ https://wordhistories.net/2019/07/16/shanghai-kidnap/ , in 1857, in San Francisco, they considered the term vulgar slang: > It was suspected that he had been drugged and carried off, or, as it is vulgarly called, “Shanghaied,” on the ship Oliver Jordan, which sailed yesterday.
- laserdancepony 4y agoMaybe in 1857, "vulgar" had a different meaning. Compared to "vulgar Latin", describing a latin 'dialect' spoken by the masses (in contrast to Cicero's Latin) even after dissolution of the roman empire, reaching its pinnacle in the arguable descendent 'roman' languages (French etc.).
- neilv 4y agoGood point.
- laserdancepony 4y agoYour language policing demands are alien to me. I am pretty much aware of the history of the term but disagree. I remember the rampant public discussion in Germany about properly naming the disease caused by SARS-CoV-2, denouncing prior examples to name new diseases by their (perceived) country of origin (compared to Syphilis, which was named by the Germans as "French disease", and by the French as "Neapolitan disease" etc.). Telling people how to talk is just wrong in my opinion.
- piva00 4y ago> Telling people how to talk is just wrong in my opinion. I don't think it's necessarily wrong, my issue with it is that the policing comes usually with snark. As if only total disgust to a term and a middling aggressive tone will help. I only got to learn how some terms can be harmful through empathy, and try to apply that when trying to make a point about why I think using term such-and-such wrong. Even then I still reject when someone approaches someone's perceived non-politically correct speech with snark, we should save that for egregious instances of it, not for small slights...
- khazhoux 4y agoAt least in the US, the COVID naming thing was most definitely a political issue. Trump called it the "CHINA-virus" not as a neutral country-of-origin differentiator, but specifically to lay blame on China and to deflect responsibility inside the US for dealing with the disease. I think it was more than appropriate to push back on that term, which was promoted only to redirect outrage away from the Administration. > Telling people how to talk is just wrong in my opinion Everyone has their line, though. Not knowing anything about you, I will wager there is some language you were maybe OK with 20 years ago, which you're not cool with today?
- nwatson 4y agoChina could probably just take Vladivostok right now. Less risky than Taiwan.
- rr888 4y agoThey could take the whole of Siberia and most countries would help.
- layer8 4y agoJapan wouldn’t.
- hollerith 4y ago(According to Peter Zeihan) Russia has told China that they would nuke them if they tried to seize any Russian territory.
- alexvoda 4y agoWhich is precisely why it is extremely perilous for Russia to use nukes in Ukraine. If Russia breaks the nuclear taboo, all other countries can retaliate nuclearly against Russia. At that point China invading Russia becomes an advantageous action for China.
- nosianu 4y agoBut they are telling that to everyone. I'm not making a joke. Even back in April a Russian State Duma member made a radio poll if they should nuke Baku. That was after the first skirmishes between Azerbaijan and Armenia back then, or it may have been March. I don't remember how many but the number of people who asks for their neighbor's capital to be nuked was at least a third of the callers. So threatening to nuke somebody is completely routine for Russian government and as it seems for not insignificant parts of the angry population too. EDIT Here's an article about it: https://eurasianet.org/russian-mp-threatens-to-nuke-azerbaijan https://eurasianet.org/russian-mp-threatens-to-nuke-azerbaij... I have to add that "Delyagin’s comments were swiftly condemned by senior Russian officials" - but as I said, making the threats itself is routine even for people in government positions. At this point it's become rather meaningless to take too much notice of such frequent occurrences. Even Putin cannot help himself alluding to nukes, so it's not like you could point to certain people in particular that would be more worth listening to. In the end, does it matter? If it was possible that threatening nukes gets you whatever you want - and what Russia wants right now is really big and bad - then they could just go and do whatever afterwards. I think the only logical conclusion is that one has to ignore the threats and act as if it's only used as political and propaganda weapon. The possibility that someone will do much more has always been there, but never has it made the West back down in whatever fight it came up in, despite repeated close calls. Right now the losses of giving in would be much higher and longer lasting than in many of the previous instances. I doubt even the Cuban missile crisis was as big a deal as giving Ukraine to Russia would be. Ukraine has industry and resources in large amounts, and people, and it would be a huge boost to Russia's strength to control it all. Whether they can after hat they did is another question, but lets not underestimate the power of a brutal police state. At the very least they will spread tons and tons of misery, more and much longer than they already do, and they will have significantly more control over Europe.
- googlryas 4y agoThis doesn't seem like a great idea, if you only have Russian citizenship. You may be forced to go back to Russia at any point due to immigration issues, and once you do, you will be arrested for avoiding mandatory service/draft (if one comes...if one doesn't come, then you didn't need to flee)
- SamoyedFurFluff 4y agoDepending on where you’re going, the refugee policy may very well buy you plenty of time or accept you outright.
- throwaway290 4y agoThere is hardly a place like that. My fellow Russians that bully Ukrainians abroad are helping paint a particular image.
- morelisp 4y agoPerhaps countries should not have gutted their refugee programs over the past decade. Those seem like they would be preferable to having to deport someone so they can be forced to try to kill you.
- ClumsyPilot 4y agoIndeed, you'd think it's smart to pull the rug out from under Putin's war machine by denying him manpower.
- bambax 4y agoAs outlined in some articles today, the irony of putting deserters in jail is that Russia is also taking inmates out of prison to man its front lines.
- layer8 4y agoIt just means that he standard is changing of who counts as a criminal.
- NikolaNovak 4y agoYeah. My family and I are in Canada today precisely for that reason - we never knew when a random truck would pick my tall 15-16 year old self from the street and send me to dig trenches (different war, 25 years ago, and yet with eerie similarities)