34 ms·

Electrically heated clothing (2013)

42 points by Tevias 4y ago

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
prometheus76 4y ago
Hot water bottles or cloth bags filled with dry rice and heated in a microwave are both excellent ways to stay warm very inexpensively.
- skyfaller 4y ago
  Low-Tech Mag also recently advocated for hot water bottles: https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2022/01/the-revenge-of-the-hot-water-bottle.html https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2022/01/the-revenge-of-the... I acquired and used hot water bottles for the first time in my life last winter and I highly recommend giving them a shot, especially when seated outdoors. In terms of heat storage for a given volume, water seems very hard to beat: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_specific_heat_capacities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_specific_heat_capacit... It seems likely that for containers of equal size, water will stay warmer longer than dry rice or any other common/inexpensive material. EDIT: I occasionally hear of engineers working on materials that work better than water, but they don't seem to be catching on so far, perhaps because water works really well and is comparatively cheap: https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/130523-zeolite-thermal-storage-retains-heat-indefinitely-absorbs-four-times-more-heat-than-water https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/130523-zeolite-thermal-s...
  - ryukafalz 4y ago
    After reading their post on hot water bottles a while back I went out and got some, and I’m glad I did! They actually are very comfy in the winter. This is something I’d somehow never really encountered and it’s super simple.
    - agons 4y ago
      Just make sure to read the warning labels and take them seriously please. I believe the use of boiling water frequently causes them to rupture, inflicting burns on their users.
      - ryukafalz 4y ago
        Yeah, there’s no need to use boiling water. Hot water from the tap is plenty warm.
mantas 4y ago
Not heating a house leads to mould. It’s cheaper to keep the house adequately warm than get rid of mould.
- EamonnMR 4y ago
  Not to mention freezing pipes.
  - aqme28 4y ago
    That's not really the discussion. It is so much cheaper and easier to heat a house above freezing temps than to heat it to human-comfortable temps.
- fiat_fandango 4y ago
  Yeah, many people don't realize that the importance of climate control is more so for moisture than temperature. Although winter is "dry" it's wild how much ambient moisture humans emit - anyone who's grown any kind of mushroom can also attest to how acutely fungus react to even minute (5-10f) fluctuations in temperature. If you have a compost pile, wait for the first time in fall where soil temps dip below 70F or if you have a light freeze - you'll likely see the entirety of your compost pile fruiting with mushrooms :)
- bombcar 4y ago
  Mold is caused by not handing water vapor well, you can have a building that is not climate controlled that has no issues with mold. In fact, mold is usually caused by preventing the free-flow of water vapor while conditioning the house. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEMZk5Kjqkw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEMZk5Kjqkw Freezing pipes is another issue, but that can be remedied by conditioning to 40 or 50 degrees (freedom degrees™) but I suppose you could build a building with anti-freeze dedicated to the piping itself.
  - danans 4y ago
    Ventilation controls the mold in places you can see, like showers, but has little effect on mold growth in concealed places like sealed wall cavities. That's the far more dangerous form of mold, because you can't clean it. Many old uninsulated wood houses, despite their reputations for being preserved primarily due to their mold resistant old growth structural lumber, were preserved in major part by the fact that they were constantly being heated all winter by high capacity heating equipment like wood or coal stoves that had to put out a ton of heat (at very low efficiency) to overcome the lack of heat distribution, resulting in significant vapor drive [1] wherein radiant heat and air pressure pushes water vapor out of warm spaces through permeable walls, therefore keeping them dry. Vapor drive and the location of the dewpoint boundary are important principles in designing a house's envelope, and maintaining permanently enclosed mold sensitive materials above the dewpoint is needed to prevent mold in walls and other areas. This is especially critical in houses with vapor barriers (usually plastic film in the wall), which essentially trap vapor on either side of the barrier, so the dewpoint boundary (the line in the wall assembly maintained at a temperature where vapor condenses) should always be in a place that can easily dry out the condensate that develops there. Otherwise, mold will likely grow. 1. https://www.finehomebuilding.com/project-guides/insulation/vapor-drive https://www.finehomebuilding.com/project-guides/insulation/v...
elliottkember 4y ago
As one of the comments mentions, the best solution to cold temperatures has always been wool. As a foreigner it's striking to me how little wool is worn here in the US. It's one of the few renewable natural fibres and a fantastic insulator. Get some merino long johns and wool sweaters and you're good. It's not itchy.
- bluedino 4y ago
  One of the best purchases I ever made was a big pack of wool socks.
- galdosdi 4y ago
  As a born and raised (dyed in the wool? :P) US American, I am equally amazed it took me so long in life to discover the joy of good wool. I think it's because Americans are conditioned to just stay in their house/car/public building HVAC bubble, with AC and heat always set to about 70 Fahrenheit[1], and never having to think about the real world for more than a moment in the parking lot. As a result if you talk to Americans about this you might find all kinds of nonsense objections, like calling wool an expensive luxury. One of the truly formative experiences of my life was the first time I slept in below-freezing weather outdoors. All it took was about $250 worth combined of wool clothing and a well rated sleeping bag. It really made me realize how much more powerful body insulation is in the fight against winter cold. Suddenly it makes sense why in old Victorian books, everyone is wearing nightcaps. But it's not even that expensive. Like yeah, it does cost more upfront compared to cheap clothes that provide no temperature regulating function, just cover you up. I get it. If you're very poor, it's harder. But if wearing more wool allows you to lower the thermostat, it can pay for itself massively. For example, a good pair of very warm long underwear is about $100, and will last 2 winters (let's say 5 months each, total of 10 months) if you are too lazy to ever mend it, significantly longer if you invest half an hour a year or so into mending holes and take good care of it (eg, only wear it under pants to reduce wear) That is about $10 a month (or half as much or less if you mend) and you can easily be comfortable 10 degrees cooler with it. If you can't save $10 a month by lowering the temperature 10 degrees If you are worried about your heat bill, first invest in wool. It will pay for itself very quickly. [1] All temps in this post in Fahrenheit. Not sorry, it's better for weather discussions while Centigrade is better for chemistry/cooking.
onehp 4y ago
You're still having to breathe the cold air though, which isn't great for your health below certain temperatures. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/sep/01/how-turning-the-heat-off-this-winter-could-damage-your-health https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/sep/01/how-turning-...
- brnt 4y ago
  This is my problem. I don't mind the cold on my skin, but breathing the air gets me. Throat and nose dry up, gets itchy and scratchy. Very uncomfortable, so keaping the heater on is really the only solution I see.
- aaron695 4y ago
jasode 4y ago
For me, I'm totally fine with the house being cold and in the low 60s during the winter and just using sweatshirts and space heaters as necessary. However, some folks (especially females) don't like the ambient air being that cold because their fingers start to hurt. Can't blame people for not wanting to wear mittens at home. EDIT reply to: >(note that some people regard the use of "females" as a noun to be a red flag) Thank you for the heads up but I'm surprised "females" has become controversial. I did a cursory google check with a mainstream respectable outlet like NYTimes and they use "females" the same way I did. When did the norms change? https://www.google.com/search?q=nytimes+%22especially+females%22 https://www.google.com/search?q=nytimes+%22especially+female...
- goodpoint 4y ago
  Keeping your hand ligaments warm is crucial to prevent damage while typing. There are gaming and compression gloves for this.
  - faichai 4y ago
    That's really interesting, re. ligaments. Can you point to any resources around that, so I can learn more?
    - goodpoint 4y ago
      There are tons on material connecting cold muscles and ligaments with low blood flow and risks of inflammation. Arthritis, carpal tunnel, RSI etc. Random links: https://www.stelizabeth.com/healthyheadlines/cold-weather-and-hand-pain-what-you-need-to-know/ https://www.stelizabeth.com/healthyheadlines/cold-weather-an... https://www.barringtonortho.com/blog/carpal-tunnel-and-cold-weather-are-they-connected https://www.barringtonortho.com/blog/carpal-tunnel-and-cold-...
      - Retric 4y ago
        Those links connect cold with the symptoms of carpal tunnel syndrome not the cause of it. Are you saying it increases the risk of injury or just pain?
vivegi 4y ago
The solar version of lowtechmagazine is a great design. Same article in the solar lowtechmag website. https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2013/11/heat-your-clothes-not-your-house.html https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2013/11/heat-your-clothes-...
tiborsaas 4y ago
"Honey, turn on the electric heaters in the bedroom"
- kijin 4y ago
  Here in Korea, almost every household has heated blankets and mattress toppers. Most are heated with wires, but some have elaborate hot water tubes running through them. They come with their own thermostats and timers. Different parts of the bed can be heated to different temperatures to accommodate each person's preferences. Welcome to the future!
  - tiborsaas 4y ago
    That's great and neat, but my snarky joke was about naked activities :)
draw_down 4y ago
rkangel 4y ago
For outdoor use electrically heated clothing also has another great benefit - it broadens the useful temperature range of the clothing that you're wearing. I fly an open cockpit aircraft (an Autogyro). In the winter months I wear a soft-shell flightsuit, with an Ororo electrically heated Gilet underneath. The flightsuit itself is very warm, and the gilet provides extra insulation over my torso even when off. This is sufficient to keep me warm most of the time, but then if it does get colder I can just turn on the Gilet the appropriate amount and I'll be cosy. The heating elements are close to my skin with both the gilet and flightsuit insulation on the outside so the heat stays in where it's needed. This setup works anywhere from "slight winter chill" down to "as cold as I have encountered". And because my core is so warm, I don't even have to have too much in the way of gloves (I use some hand knitted merino roll top mittens so I can still use the controls easily).
- jollyllama 4y ago
  Yep. Same for a motorcycle; you can turn on the heated gear when you get on the highway.
wyager 4y ago
> Heat Your Clothes, Not Your House In the name of environmentalism, you will live like an impoverished, preindustrial Inuit, but without any of the upside.
- panosfilianos 4y ago
  I think the upside is not burning through the limited resources of the planet needlessly.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
mrinterweb 4y ago
I wonder what the longevity of electrically heated clothing is after it has been through the wash and dryer many cycles. That is an important detail.
JoeAltmaier 4y ago
Back in the 60's (?) magazines proposed not heating houses at all, but just broadcasting microwaves that would heat your skin and make you feel warm! Microwaves were a new thing, and lots of purposes got invented.
- brnt 4y ago
  infrared heating panelsnare getting more common as form a spot heating so i guess the future happened.
mikro2nd 4y ago
What I really want is USB powered heating in my bones. Like just the long bones in the arms and legs would be fine. Or wirelessly powered (put the charge in my mouse-pad.)
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
jawadch93 4y ago
basicplus2 4y ago
When i was a young lad in the seventies, our local town shop had shirts and pants you could plug into the electrical system on your tractor during the cold days (before cabins were a thing)
- bluedino 4y ago
  They make those for motorcycles
  - WkndTriathlete 4y ago
    And snowmobiles
beardyw 4y ago
> Making use of low voltages for safety Safe from electrocution maybe, but not from burns.
- Forge36 4y ago
  I would definitely not sleep in heated clothes. For sitting outside for long periods it's nice to be able to turn on if I need it.

42 points by Tevias 4y ago

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

Hot water bottles or cloth bags filled with dry rice and heated in a microwave are both excellent ways to stay warm very inexpensively.

skyfaller 4y ago
Low-Tech Mag also recently advocated for hot water bottles: https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2022/01/the-revenge-of-the-hot-water-bottle.html https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2022/01/the-revenge-of-the... I acquired and used hot water bottles for the first time in my life last winter and I highly recommend giving them a shot, especially when seated outdoors. In terms of heat storage for a given volume, water seems very hard to beat: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_specific_heat_capacities https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_specific_heat_capacit... It seems likely that for containers of equal size, water will stay warmer longer than dry rice or any other common/inexpensive material. EDIT: I occasionally hear of engineers working on materials that work better than water, but they don't seem to be catching on so far, perhaps because water works really well and is comparatively cheap: https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/130523-zeolite-thermal-storage-retains-heat-indefinitely-absorbs-four-times-more-heat-than-water https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/130523-zeolite-thermal-s...
- ryukafalz 4y ago
  After reading their post on hot water bottles a while back I went out and got some, and I’m glad I did! They actually are very comfy in the winter. This is something I’d somehow never really encountered and it’s super simple.
  - agons 4y ago
    Just make sure to read the warning labels and take them seriously please. I believe the use of boiling water frequently causes them to rupture, inflicting burns on their users.
    - ryukafalz 4y ago
      Yeah, there’s no need to use boiling water. Hot water from the tap is plenty warm.

mantas 4y ago

Not heating a house leads to mould. It’s cheaper to keep the house adequately warm than get rid of mould.

EamonnMR 4y ago
Not to mention freezing pipes.
- aqme28 4y ago
  That's not really the discussion. It is so much cheaper and easier to heat a house above freezing temps than to heat it to human-comfortable temps.
fiat_fandango 4y ago
Yeah, many people don't realize that the importance of climate control is more so for moisture than temperature. Although winter is "dry" it's wild how much ambient moisture humans emit - anyone who's grown any kind of mushroom can also attest to how acutely fungus react to even minute (5-10f) fluctuations in temperature. If you have a compost pile, wait for the first time in fall where soil temps dip below 70F or if you have a light freeze - you'll likely see the entirety of your compost pile fruiting with mushrooms :)
bombcar 4y ago
Mold is caused by not handing water vapor well, you can have a building that is not climate controlled that has no issues with mold. In fact, mold is usually caused by preventing the free-flow of water vapor while conditioning the house. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEMZk5Kjqkw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IEMZk5Kjqkw Freezing pipes is another issue, but that can be remedied by conditioning to 40 or 50 degrees (freedom degrees™) but I suppose you could build a building with anti-freeze dedicated to the piping itself.
- danans 4y ago
  Ventilation controls the mold in places you can see, like showers, but has little effect on mold growth in concealed places like sealed wall cavities. That's the far more dangerous form of mold, because you can't clean it. Many old uninsulated wood houses, despite their reputations for being preserved primarily due to their mold resistant old growth structural lumber, were preserved in major part by the fact that they were constantly being heated all winter by high capacity heating equipment like wood or coal stoves that had to put out a ton of heat (at very low efficiency) to overcome the lack of heat distribution, resulting in significant vapor drive [1] wherein radiant heat and air pressure pushes water vapor out of warm spaces through permeable walls, therefore keeping them dry. Vapor drive and the location of the dewpoint boundary are important principles in designing a house's envelope, and maintaining permanently enclosed mold sensitive materials above the dewpoint is needed to prevent mold in walls and other areas. This is especially critical in houses with vapor barriers (usually plastic film in the wall), which essentially trap vapor on either side of the barrier, so the dewpoint boundary (the line in the wall assembly maintained at a temperature where vapor condenses) should always be in a place that can easily dry out the condensate that develops there. Otherwise, mold will likely grow. 1. https://www.finehomebuilding.com/project-guides/insulation/vapor-drive https://www.finehomebuilding.com/project-guides/insulation/v...

elliottkember 4y ago

As one of the comments mentions, the best solution to cold temperatures has always been wool. As a foreigner it's striking to me how little wool is worn here in the US. It's one of the few renewable natural fibres and a fantastic insulator. Get some merino long johns and wool sweaters and you're good. It's not itchy.

bluedino 4y ago
One of the best purchases I ever made was a big pack of wool socks.
galdosdi 4y ago
As a born and raised (dyed in the wool? :P) US American, I am equally amazed it took me so long in life to discover the joy of good wool. I think it's because Americans are conditioned to just stay in their house/car/public building HVAC bubble, with AC and heat always set to about 70 Fahrenheit[1], and never having to think about the real world for more than a moment in the parking lot. As a result if you talk to Americans about this you might find all kinds of nonsense objections, like calling wool an expensive luxury. One of the truly formative experiences of my life was the first time I slept in below-freezing weather outdoors. All it took was about $250 worth combined of wool clothing and a well rated sleeping bag. It really made me realize how much more powerful body insulation is in the fight against winter cold. Suddenly it makes sense why in old Victorian books, everyone is wearing nightcaps. But it's not even that expensive. Like yeah, it does cost more upfront compared to cheap clothes that provide no temperature regulating function, just cover you up. I get it. If you're very poor, it's harder. But if wearing more wool allows you to lower the thermostat, it can pay for itself massively. For example, a good pair of very warm long underwear is about $100, and will last 2 winters (let's say 5 months each, total of 10 months) if you are too lazy to ever mend it, significantly longer if you invest half an hour a year or so into mending holes and take good care of it (eg, only wear it under pants to reduce wear) That is about $10 a month (or half as much or less if you mend) and you can easily be comfortable 10 degrees cooler with it. If you can't save $10 a month by lowering the temperature 10 degrees If you are worried about your heat bill, first invest in wool. It will pay for itself very quickly. [1] All temps in this post in Fahrenheit. Not sorry, it's better for weather discussions while Centigrade is better for chemistry/cooking.

onehp 4y ago

You're still having to breathe the cold air though, which isn't great for your health below certain temperatures. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/sep/01/how-turning-the-heat-off-this-winter-could-damage-your-health https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/sep/01/how-turning-...

brnt 4y ago
This is my problem. I don't mind the cold on my skin, but breathing the air gets me. Throat and nose dry up, gets itchy and scratchy. Very uncomfortable, so keaping the heater on is really the only solution I see.
aaron695 4y ago

jasode 4y ago

For me, I'm totally fine with the house being cold and in the low 60s during the winter and just using sweatshirts and space heaters as necessary. However, some folks (especially females) don't like the ambient air being that cold because their fingers start to hurt. Can't blame people for not wanting to wear mittens at home. EDIT reply to: >(note that some people regard the use of "females" as a noun to be a red flag) Thank you for the heads up but I'm surprised "females" has become controversial. I did a cursory google check with a mainstream respectable outlet like NYTimes and they use "females" the same way I did. When did the norms change? https://www.google.com/search?q=nytimes+%22especially+females%22 https://www.google.com/search?q=nytimes+%22especially+female...

goodpoint 4y ago
Keeping your hand ligaments warm is crucial to prevent damage while typing. There are gaming and compression gloves for this.
- faichai 4y ago
  That's really interesting, re. ligaments. Can you point to any resources around that, so I can learn more?
  - goodpoint 4y ago
    There are tons on material connecting cold muscles and ligaments with low blood flow and risks of inflammation. Arthritis, carpal tunnel, RSI etc. Random links: https://www.stelizabeth.com/healthyheadlines/cold-weather-and-hand-pain-what-you-need-to-know/ https://www.stelizabeth.com/healthyheadlines/cold-weather-an... https://www.barringtonortho.com/blog/carpal-tunnel-and-cold-weather-are-they-connected https://www.barringtonortho.com/blog/carpal-tunnel-and-cold-...
    - Retric 4y ago
      Those links connect cold with the symptoms of carpal tunnel syndrome not the cause of it. Are you saying it increases the risk of injury or just pain?

vivegi 4y ago

The solar version of lowtechmagazine is a great design. Same article in the solar lowtechmag website. https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2013/11/heat-your-clothes-not-your-house.html https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2013/11/heat-your-clothes-...

tiborsaas 4y ago

"Honey, turn on the electric heaters in the bedroom"

kijin 4y ago
Here in Korea, almost every household has heated blankets and mattress toppers. Most are heated with wires, but some have elaborate hot water tubes running through them. They come with their own thermostats and timers. Different parts of the bed can be heated to different temperatures to accommodate each person's preferences. Welcome to the future!
- tiborsaas 4y ago
  That's great and neat, but my snarky joke was about naked activities :)

draw_down 4y ago

rkangel 4y ago

For outdoor use electrically heated clothing also has another great benefit - it broadens the useful temperature range of the clothing that you're wearing. I fly an open cockpit aircraft (an Autogyro). In the winter months I wear a soft-shell flightsuit, with an Ororo electrically heated Gilet underneath. The flightsuit itself is very warm, and the gilet provides extra insulation over my torso even when off. This is sufficient to keep me warm most of the time, but then if it does get colder I can just turn on the Gilet the appropriate amount and I'll be cosy. The heating elements are close to my skin with both the gilet and flightsuit insulation on the outside so the heat stays in where it's needed. This setup works anywhere from "slight winter chill" down to "as cold as I have encountered". And because my core is so warm, I don't even have to have too much in the way of gloves (I use some hand knitted merino roll top mittens so I can still use the controls easily).

jollyllama 4y ago
Yep. Same for a motorcycle; you can turn on the heated gear when you get on the highway.

wyager 4y ago

> Heat Your Clothes, Not Your House In the name of environmentalism, you will live like an impoverished, preindustrial Inuit, but without any of the upside.

panosfilianos 4y ago
I think the upside is not burning through the limited resources of the planet needlessly.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

mrinterweb 4y ago

I wonder what the longevity of electrically heated clothing is after it has been through the wash and dryer many cycles. That is an important detail.

JoeAltmaier 4y ago

Back in the 60's (?) magazines proposed not heating houses at all, but just broadcasting microwaves that would heat your skin and make you feel warm! Microwaves were a new thing, and lots of purposes got invented.

brnt 4y ago
infrared heating panelsnare getting more common as form a spot heating so i guess the future happened.

mikro2nd 4y ago

What I really want is USB powered heating in my bones. Like just the long bones in the arms and legs would be fine. Or wirelessly powered (put the charge in my mouse-pad.)

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

jawadch93 4y ago

basicplus2 4y ago

When i was a young lad in the seventies, our local town shop had shirts and pants you could plug into the electrical system on your tractor during the cold days (before cabins were a thing)

bluedino 4y ago
They make those for motorcycles
- WkndTriathlete 4y ago
  And snowmobiles

beardyw 4y ago

> Making use of low voltages for safety Safe from electrocution maybe, but not from burns.

Forge36 4y ago
I would definitely not sleep in heated clothes. For sitting outside for long periods it's nice to be able to turn on if I need it.