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> Who cares about it's recent political pivoting? People who vote for them. You have zero evidence that the regiment follows a neonazi agenda. Neither does th

by _glsb 4y ago

> Who cares about it's recent political pivoting? People who vote for them. You have zero evidence that the regiment follows a neonazi agenda. Neither does the National Guard, the Army, nor the government. Not to mention that Azov itself is multiethnic. Russians on the other hand have filtration camps and TV hosts on government channels call for nuclear war, ethnic cleansing and destruction of the Ukrainian national identity. Thank god they have nice logos though, otherwise they'd seem like Nazis! /s > Beg your pardon? You were the one to bring up the topic of ethnicity, not me. I didn't make any ethnic assertions. You started the "brothers slavs" trope. > And specifically, what symbols so commonly associated... Again, "symbol scary". Azov has no stated political goals against any minority / groups of population. AfD has. FN has. UKIP has. > Duke Nukem had a reboot and an aniversary edition a few years ago... Are they as popular as the original then? > Is this a verifiable claim? Ask a russian.

foverzar 4y ago
> People who vote for them. And why would we care about them, at least in context of this specific discussion? > You have zero evidence that the regiment follows a neonazi agenda. The evidence is plenty, although might feel inaccessable when naive-googling without setting filter to before the great post-truth of 2022. Azov recruiting neonazis: https://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/ukraine-deutsche-soeldner-heuern-bei-rechtsextremem-freiwilligenbataillon-an-a-1177400.html?utm_campaign=buffer&utm_content=bufferfd37d&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com https://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/ukraine-deutsche-soel... Azov being your typical far-right brute force thugs, targeting identity groups: https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-far-right-vigilantes-destroy-another-romany-camp-in-kyiv/29280336.html https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-far-right-vigilantes-destroy... https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-azov-right-wing-militia-to-patrol-kyiv/29008036.html https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-azov-right-wing-militia-to-p... https://khpg.org/en/1517275970 https://khpg.org/en/1517275970 They even have their own hitlerjugend: https://youtu.be/CpV16BQfbrQ https://youtu.be/CpV16BQfbrQ And we've already discussed the symbolics that you were so fast to dismiss. I'm sorry, but if it's recruiting neonazis, dresses as neonazis and operates like neonazis, it's neonazis. I'm not sure what argument could be made here. The government is a whole another matter. Sure, Israel is not happy with some of its politics, and the Odessa fires incident (specifically the investigation of it) doesn't inspire confidence, but it's hard to clearly distinct policy of one from the network effect of turing a militant skinheads brigade into glorified policie. > I didn't make any ethnic assertions. You started the "brothers slavs" trope. Trope? Slavic people were historicaly kinda disjointed, I am not sure where you had inferred all that "brother" stuff from. > Again, "symbol scary". Azov has no stated political goals against any minority / groups of population. AfD has. FN has. UKIP has. I dunno, their statements seem pretty clear to me: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/apr/11/ultranationalism-in-ukraine-a-photo-essay https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/apr/11/ultranationali... > Are they as popular as the original then? Correcting for the explosive expansion of the industry, yeah, I'd say the genre had marked itself pretty solidly. > Ask a russian. So you actually have no idea?
- jevgeni 4y ago
  So you cherry pick facts from the time when they weren't even a formal group or cleaned up by the National Guard, you disingenuously then equate Azov battalion with a random ultra-right march from 2019 and refuse to acknowledge or educate yourself about the literal ethnofascist policies of russia. Well done.

by _glsb 4y ago

foverzar 4y ago

> People who vote for them. And why would we care about them, at least in context of this specific discussion? > You have zero evidence that the regiment follows a neonazi agenda. The evidence is plenty, although might feel inaccessable when naive-googling without setting filter to before the great post-truth of 2022. Azov recruiting neonazis: https://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/ukraine-deutsche-soeldner-heuern-bei-rechtsextremem-freiwilligenbataillon-an-a-1177400.html?utm_campaign=buffer&utm_content=bufferfd37d&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com https://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/ukraine-deutsche-soel... Azov being your typical far-right brute force thugs, targeting identity groups: https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-far-right-vigilantes-destroy-another-romany-camp-in-kyiv/29280336.html https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-far-right-vigilantes-destroy... https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-azov-right-wing-militia-to-patrol-kyiv/29008036.html https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-azov-right-wing-militia-to-p... https://khpg.org/en/1517275970 https://khpg.org/en/1517275970 They even have their own hitlerjugend: https://youtu.be/CpV16BQfbrQ https://youtu.be/CpV16BQfbrQ And we've already discussed the symbolics that you were so fast to dismiss. I'm sorry, but if it's recruiting neonazis, dresses as neonazis and operates like neonazis, it's neonazis. I'm not sure what argument could be made here. The government is a whole another matter. Sure, Israel is not happy with some of its politics, and the Odessa fires incident (specifically the investigation of it) doesn't inspire confidence, but it's hard to clearly distinct policy of one from the network effect of turing a militant skinheads brigade into glorified policie. > I didn't make any ethnic assertions. You started the "brothers slavs" trope. Trope? Slavic people were historicaly kinda disjointed, I am not sure where you had inferred all that "brother" stuff from. > Again, "symbol scary". Azov has no stated political goals against any minority / groups of population. AfD has. FN has. UKIP has. I dunno, their statements seem pretty clear to me: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/apr/11/ultranationalism-in-ukraine-a-photo-essay https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/apr/11/ultranationali... > Are they as popular as the original then? Correcting for the explosive expansion of the industry, yeah, I'd say the genre had marked itself pretty solidly. > Ask a russian. So you actually have no idea?

jevgeni 4y ago
So you cherry pick facts from the time when they weren't even a formal group or cleaned up by the National Guard, you disingenuously then equate Azov battalion with a random ultra-right march from 2019 and refuse to acknowledge or educate yourself about the literal ethnofascist policies of russia. Well done.