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First, people often imply that everything around RISC-V is open source, which is not the case (unfortunately). Second, no they are not always interoperable - c

First, people often imply that everything around RISC-V is open source, which is not the case (unfortunately). Second, no they are not always interoperable - custom extensions to the ISA are allowed.

Brian_K_White 4y ago
I can take a copy of linux and modify it to produce a kernel that can't run anyone else's binaries. This is irrelevant to the essentially infinite value created by linux being open in the first place. You still have access to the same linux I started with to make my custom one. I didn't need anyone's permission to modify it for my purpose, and you don't need anyone's permission to take my same starting point and 99.99% of the engineering in my product. This is just from the basic availability like MIT/BSD where I don't have to give back, not even counting the extra boost that gpl or cc-sa creates. I don't think immediate interoperability is a very important part of this. It's already good enough that the open nature makes interoperability possible if anyone happens to need it and aren't getting it from a vendor. Same goes for things like extended support or adding or removing features. If a manufacturer stops selling a chip you want, or triples the price, or adds hostile features, or any of the other ways manufacturers use to control consuption, anyone else is able to start supplying the same thing. It still costs resources to do it, but there is no artificial block because of patents.
- goodpoint 4y ago
  > I can take a copy of linux... We all know this already, thanks... > anyone else is able to start supplying the same thing Not if there's a custom extension. Additionally, "supplying the same thing" is equivalent of asking someone to write a perfect drop-in replacement for the Linux kernel, to connect to your example. It's not that simple, by far. > It still costs resources to do it, but there is no artificial block because of patents. Actually, no. CPU IP can be patented and no, RISC-V does not prohibit it. You are asking for someone to design a new CPU, while also supporting whatever custom extension already exists, while also navigating the huge patent minefield.
  - Brian_K_White 4y ago
    >> I can take a copy of linux... > We all know this already, thanks... I would not be so eager to advertize my ignorance of such simple language devices. Are you sure you want to play that stupid? It's not usually the best way to show how on top of things you are and how much your opinions matter and how seriously everyone else should take your reasoning and arguments. Anyway... Patended customizations are irrelevant. If the open part of a risc-v cpu or platform may or may not be the entire end-user product, so what? So there is one open brick and a useful product needs 10 bricks and some of those other bricks don't exist in an open form yet. So what? It in no way invalidates the value of attaining any given one of the bricks. Sooner or later, if not already, now that some parts exist, someone will tackle the next part and the next part. It is exactly "that simple" by far.

First, people often imply that everything around RISC-V is open source, which is not the case (unfortunately). Second, no they are not always interoperable - custom extensions to the ISA are allowed.

Brian_K_White 4y ago

I can take a copy of linux and modify it to produce a kernel that can't run anyone else's binaries. This is irrelevant to the essentially infinite value created by linux being open in the first place. You still have access to the same linux I started with to make my custom one. I didn't need anyone's permission to modify it for my purpose, and you don't need anyone's permission to take my same starting point and 99.99% of the engineering in my product. This is just from the basic availability like MIT/BSD where I don't have to give back, not even counting the extra boost that gpl or cc-sa creates. I don't think immediate interoperability is a very important part of this. It's already good enough that the open nature makes interoperability possible if anyone happens to need it and aren't getting it from a vendor. Same goes for things like extended support or adding or removing features. If a manufacturer stops selling a chip you want, or triples the price, or adds hostile features, or any of the other ways manufacturers use to control consuption, anyone else is able to start supplying the same thing. It still costs resources to do it, but there is no artificial block because of patents.

goodpoint 4y ago
> I can take a copy of linux... We all know this already, thanks... > anyone else is able to start supplying the same thing Not if there's a custom extension. Additionally, "supplying the same thing" is equivalent of asking someone to write a perfect drop-in replacement for the Linux kernel, to connect to your example. It's not that simple, by far. > It still costs resources to do it, but there is no artificial block because of patents. Actually, no. CPU IP can be patented and no, RISC-V does not prohibit it. You are asking for someone to design a new CPU, while also supporting whatever custom extension already exists, while also navigating the huge patent minefield.
- Brian_K_White 4y ago
  >> I can take a copy of linux... > We all know this already, thanks... I would not be so eager to advertize my ignorance of such simple language devices. Are you sure you want to play that stupid? It's not usually the best way to show how on top of things you are and how much your opinions matter and how seriously everyone else should take your reasoning and arguments. Anyway... Patended customizations are irrelevant. If the open part of a risc-v cpu or platform may or may not be the entire end-user product, so what? So there is one open brick and a useful product needs 10 bricks and some of those other bricks don't exist in an open form yet. So what? It in no way invalidates the value of attaining any given one of the bricks. Sooner or later, if not already, now that some parts exist, someone will tackle the next part and the next part. It is exactly "that simple" by far.