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> You sound like someone from the 90's dismissing Linux. Software seems to be very different from hardware. How would a company like Red Hat, Canonical or basi
by qwytw 4y ago
> You sound like someone from the 90's dismissing Linux.
Software seems to be very different from hardware. How would a company like Red Hat, Canonical or basically almost every enterprise company which primarily relies on Linux/OSS/GNU products make money from RISC-V? The cost of entry is much higher and there is no clear way of building a business around open source RISC-V (yet)
> The bottom line is that ARM represents vendor lock-in and broken market with only one seller
Yes. But why would anyone who which was capable of building a high-end RISC-V core give their design away for free? Unless there is a clear incentive for them to do that it’s objectively worse than the current situation where anyone can license a high-end CPU design from ARM.
> like Apple did for user machines) but it's certain it won't choose the ARM arch
Right, except in the one case where they did choose ARM?
> that would make no sense
Why? As long as the cost of designing such a processor remains very high, there are no open source designs available and it’s cheaper to build on top of what ARM than build it from scratch it makes perfect sense.
I mean in principle I agree with you. It would be great if CPU design was open source, anyone could take a high end core design improve on top of it and then share their changes with everyone but I don’t see a clear path to that. Instead companies might just take what they can from the OSS community and contribute nothing back. ARM seems like a somewhat decent but far from perfect solution for this (as long as it remains independent)
- snvzz 4y ago>Right, except in the one case where they did choose ARM? You mean the M1? I'm fairly sure this was designed even before the RISC-V base spec, the unprivileged one (no supervisor vs user, or MMU), was ratified. It was ratified in 2019, by the way. The batch of extensions ratified by the end of 2021 contains important featuresets like vector or hypervisor support. So, of course they didn't pick RISC-V back then. Yet, nobody in their right mind would pick ARM today.
- afiori 4y agoLeaving aside the merits of the two ISAs, for Apple using ARM for the M1 had the huge advantage unifying all their devices to a single ISA. Based on just that (and the fact that they own a perpetual license to all things ARM) they would likely make the same choice now and even in a couple of years.
- snvzz 4y ago>for Apple using ARM for the M1 had the huge advantage unifying all their devices to a single ISA. Wait, let me read that again. Oh, so you're saying that Apple wants to unify their ISA... by switching their already ARM smaller/hidden cores to RISC-V? Yeah, it does not make sense to me, either.
- afiori 4y agoNo I am saying that even if RISC-V was strictly better than ARM Apple would have likely still chosen ARM for the M1 generation as it would be the simplest way to unify their ISAs across their devices.