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Doesn't give up when the first thing they try doesn't work. There's a clear difference between someone with grit and someone without. A person without grit wi

Doesn't give up when the first thing they try doesn't work. There's a clear difference between someone with grit and someone without. A person without grit will message me on slack with a half baked question that is practically, "I tried almost nothing and I'm stuck, can you solve this for me?"

nathias 4y ago
this is very weird, I never even seen a junior behave like that ...
- wnolens 4y ago
  That's surprising. It happens with junior engineers who aren't used to having to solve tough problems. Most will take feedback and improve though. It also happens with more intermediate or senior engineers who have been able to get away without rigorous methods to solve problems. Maybe they are used to an overly helpful tech lead, or they have changed domains to something more challenging/where stack overflow doesn't have the answer. Many a time I've been faced with obscure build/environment issues that no one on my team has seen, and googling doesn't provide any easy out. At that point, I feel the necessity for grit. It's a good word too, as it can feel like sandpaper on my soul to start cracking open codebases I wished just worked to get past a complete impasse that my deadline didn't account for me to face.
queuep 4y ago
This is it. There’s a real shortage in tech of people that are willing to try before asking. (I’m not in the US)
- antupis 4y ago
  I think this cultural thing because Finland it is much more common that people try like 2 weeks and don't ask those stupid questions. It of course speeds up learning but other-hand some problems could be solve like hours instead of weeks.
  - djbusby 4y ago
    Have to know the balance. Try three things, then ask the next person up the chain for a pointer.
    - f1shy 4y ago
      Lately I've seen a strong tendency, where I work, to see people with less knowledge "up the chain". Is there only where I am. From your comment, seems to be different where you are. If I'm stuck with something, the LAST place where I search for answers is "up" in the hierarchy.
      - jokethrowaway 4y ago
        It's common everywhere larger than X people. That's why bigger orgs are inefficient and need to acquire smaller companies to get stuff done. Middle managers give the impression of doing something useful without actually being able to do much.
  - carlmr 4y ago
    >It of course speeds up learning but other-hand some problems could be solve like hours instead of weeks. The question is how many times these hours are spent. If the project is due tomorrow, it's worth asking ten people for a few hours of their time. If it's not urgent, blocking those ten people for a few hours might lead to more work time being spent on the problem than you figuring it out. I think there's a sweet spot in between asking too little and too much, and it's contextual.
- MattGaiser 4y ago
  At least everywhere I have worked, employers have been far more worried about the opposite of employees spending time on things that have easy answers, if only they had asked.
  - someweirdperson 4y ago
    With this, what they mean by "grit" is: Don't ask questions, but solve things in the way I was thinking of, with no detours.
  - wnolens 4y ago
    Yes that is fairly common with younger engineers. It's up to senior engineers/tech lead/manager to detect that and then give feedback, helping that engineer grow. It's also an important quality for an engineer to be able to take feedback and correct. Grit isn't the only important quality.
spookierookie 4y ago
Good explanation but not what I'd perceive from a post asking for grit. FWIW I'd think what the OP thinks (and shy away).

nathias 4y ago

this is very weird, I never even seen a junior behave like that ...

wnolens 4y ago
That's surprising. It happens with junior engineers who aren't used to having to solve tough problems. Most will take feedback and improve though. It also happens with more intermediate or senior engineers who have been able to get away without rigorous methods to solve problems. Maybe they are used to an overly helpful tech lead, or they have changed domains to something more challenging/where stack overflow doesn't have the answer. Many a time I've been faced with obscure build/environment issues that no one on my team has seen, and googling doesn't provide any easy out. At that point, I feel the necessity for grit. It's a good word too, as it can feel like sandpaper on my soul to start cracking open codebases I wished just worked to get past a complete impasse that my deadline didn't account for me to face.

queuep 4y ago

This is it. There’s a real shortage in tech of people that are willing to try before asking. (I’m not in the US)

antupis 4y ago
I think this cultural thing because Finland it is much more common that people try like 2 weeks and don't ask those stupid questions. It of course speeds up learning but other-hand some problems could be solve like hours instead of weeks.
- djbusby 4y ago
  Have to know the balance. Try three things, then ask the next person up the chain for a pointer.
  - f1shy 4y ago
    Lately I've seen a strong tendency, where I work, to see people with less knowledge "up the chain". Is there only where I am. From your comment, seems to be different where you are. If I'm stuck with something, the LAST place where I search for answers is "up" in the hierarchy.
    - jokethrowaway 4y ago
      It's common everywhere larger than X people. That's why bigger orgs are inefficient and need to acquire smaller companies to get stuff done. Middle managers give the impression of doing something useful without actually being able to do much.
- carlmr 4y ago
  >It of course speeds up learning but other-hand some problems could be solve like hours instead of weeks. The question is how many times these hours are spent. If the project is due tomorrow, it's worth asking ten people for a few hours of their time. If it's not urgent, blocking those ten people for a few hours might lead to more work time being spent on the problem than you figuring it out. I think there's a sweet spot in between asking too little and too much, and it's contextual.
MattGaiser 4y ago
At least everywhere I have worked, employers have been far more worried about the opposite of employees spending time on things that have easy answers, if only they had asked.
- someweirdperson 4y ago
  With this, what they mean by "grit" is: Don't ask questions, but solve things in the way I was thinking of, with no detours.
- wnolens 4y ago
  Yes that is fairly common with younger engineers. It's up to senior engineers/tech lead/manager to detect that and then give feedback, helping that engineer grow. It's also an important quality for an engineer to be able to take feedback and correct. Grit isn't the only important quality.

spookierookie 4y ago

Good explanation but not what I'd perceive from a post asking for grit. FWIW I'd think what the OP thinks (and shy away).