4 ms·

There's one thing you don't get, which I see many people find they miss: savestates. It's technically possible and I know a few cores try to support them, but i

There's one thing you don't get, which I see many people find they miss: savestates. It's technically possible and I know a few cores try to support them, but it's just a million times easier (and more reliable) if you do everything in software anyway. Hardware emulation has a pretty small niche between software emulation and real hardware. If you care about accuracy at all costs, real hardware is usually still available and not too expensive, and if you care about convenience, software emulation is better.

fermentation 4y ago
I personally have found it more enjoyable to play a lot of games without savestates. Playing earthbound a few years ago I was constantly savescumming. My recently replay on mister without savetsates was way more enjoyable because the stakes were higher. Wouldn’t want to play a Mario World rom hack without them though
reidrac 4y ago
> real hardware is usually still available and not too expensive I all depends. There's a "retro" bubble currently and people ask silly money for the original hardware. Then capacitors burst, original hardware needs maintenance, and is not something everybody can do. The MISTer provides an experience that gets very close to the original hardware, without all those nuances.
- vintermann 4y ago
  Oh they ASK silly money sure, but do they get it? I only keep track of the Commodore part of the retro world, and from what I've seen, most machines are still cheaper than they were at launch, not only in inflation adjusted terms but in absolute terms too. Even machines which are bought for restoration and resold (with fresh capacitors and QoL modifications like modernized video output) are very reasonably priced. I think the underlying reason for those low prices is that software emulation really is the better option for most people.
flatiron 4y ago
I’m unsure what you mean about hardware emulation not being reliable. Save states is a good point. SNES for example does not have them. Adding that stuff as an after thought is extremely tricky. Most newer cores are creating with save states in mind for two reasons. Makes debugging much easier as you can share states with testers on top of the QOL you get with that feature for end users. PSX for example has really good save state support with rotating save states.
- vintermann 4y ago
  Hardware emulation is of course reliable, it is hardware save states which might not be. And yeah, if you design for them for the start they probably work better. Possibly "newer" architectures like PSX are also cleaner about where they keep state?
  - flatiron 4y ago
    The reason snes doesn’t have them is because of the expansion chips. Each of those chips need their state recorded synced to the main system. Pita
I_AM_A_SMURF 4y ago
Retro hardware is available, and maybe it's not too expensive, however retro hardware _with_ HDMI or otherwise clean digital output? not so cheap. A good HDMI scaler is hundreds of dollars, plus you need RGB-modded consoles to get good output.
- jonhohle 4y ago
  OSSC is reasonably inexpensive, and with the exception of the NES and N64 nearly all retro consoles output RGB without modification (but may require the appropriate cable). There are better scalers and mods for possibly cleaner audio and video for nearly all consoles, but with few exceptions an OSSC or RetroTink will get you 99% of the way there. The last 1% is chasing audiophile levels of quality improvement for audiophile levels of money, imho. RetroRGB and My Life in Gaming are fantastic resources for nearly all retro gamers of any budget. You don’t have to spend a lot to get old hardware looking really great and low latency on modern displays.

fermentation 4y ago

I personally have found it more enjoyable to play a lot of games without savestates. Playing earthbound a few years ago I was constantly savescumming. My recently replay on mister without savetsates was way more enjoyable because the stakes were higher. Wouldn’t want to play a Mario World rom hack without them though

reidrac 4y ago

> real hardware is usually still available and not too expensive I all depends. There's a "retro" bubble currently and people ask silly money for the original hardware. Then capacitors burst, original hardware needs maintenance, and is not something everybody can do. The MISTer provides an experience that gets very close to the original hardware, without all those nuances.

vintermann 4y ago
Oh they ASK silly money sure, but do they get it? I only keep track of the Commodore part of the retro world, and from what I've seen, most machines are still cheaper than they were at launch, not only in inflation adjusted terms but in absolute terms too. Even machines which are bought for restoration and resold (with fresh capacitors and QoL modifications like modernized video output) are very reasonably priced. I think the underlying reason for those low prices is that software emulation really is the better option for most people.

flatiron 4y ago

I’m unsure what you mean about hardware emulation not being reliable. Save states is a good point. SNES for example does not have them. Adding that stuff as an after thought is extremely tricky. Most newer cores are creating with save states in mind for two reasons. Makes debugging much easier as you can share states with testers on top of the QOL you get with that feature for end users. PSX for example has really good save state support with rotating save states.

vintermann 4y ago
Hardware emulation is of course reliable, it is hardware save states which might not be. And yeah, if you design for them for the start they probably work better. Possibly "newer" architectures like PSX are also cleaner about where they keep state?
- flatiron 4y ago
  The reason snes doesn’t have them is because of the expansion chips. Each of those chips need their state recorded synced to the main system. Pita

I_AM_A_SMURF 4y ago

Retro hardware is available, and maybe it's not too expensive, however retro hardware _with_ HDMI or otherwise clean digital output? not so cheap. A good HDMI scaler is hundreds of dollars, plus you need RGB-modded consoles to get good output.

jonhohle 4y ago
OSSC is reasonably inexpensive, and with the exception of the NES and N64 nearly all retro consoles output RGB without modification (but may require the appropriate cable). There are better scalers and mods for possibly cleaner audio and video for nearly all consoles, but with few exceptions an OSSC or RetroTink will get you 99% of the way there. The last 1% is chasing audiophile levels of quality improvement for audiophile levels of money, imho. RetroRGB and My Life in Gaming are fantastic resources for nearly all retro gamers of any budget. You don’t have to spend a lot to get old hardware looking really great and low latency on modern displays.