4 ms·

> I don't see how the heck my website is a public square but my home or café isn't, this argument sounds self-contradictory. If it's a website with over 50 mil

> I don't see how the heck my website is a public square but my home or café isn't, this argument sounds self-contradictory. If it's a website with over 50 million users, and it's designed explicitly as a place for these users to express themselves, then calling it "a public square" seems entirely warranted.

deleted 4y ago
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themitigating 4y ago
Why?
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- NeverFade 4y ago
  If you're not protecting free speech in the places where free speech actually happens, then you are not protecting free speech at all. If speech has shifted online, to massive social media websites like Twitter, and you don't protect it there, then you have no free speech in your country.
  - themitigating 4y ago
    There's no protection for free speech in the US only that the government can't make laws restricting it
    - NeverFade 4y ago
      Freedom of Expression is a core value in the US: > Freedom of speech, of the press, of association, of assembly and petition -- this set of guarantees, protected by the First Amendment, comprises what we refer to as freedom of expression. The Supreme Court has written that this freedom is "the matrix, the indispensable condition of nearly every other form of freedom." Without it, other fundamental rights, like the right to vote, would wither and die. https://www.aclu.org/other/freedom-expression https://www.aclu.org/other/freedom-expression As expression increasingly moves online, we will have to find ways to protect it online. A future in which the vast majority of speech happens in private online platforms, that may curtail it at will, is not just dystopian but goes against core American values, and the essence of freedom.
      - themitigating 4y ago
        This is not in the constitution, you just pasted the opinions of others. Core american values? There's massive censorship of pornography, there are noise laws, library books are being challanged and removed. A town voted to defund a library because they wouldn't remove a book. Explain to me how it's a core value?
  - wvenable 4y ago
    Perhaps the problem is the definition of free speech. Free speech is you can't go to jail for what you say. It certainly doesn't mean speech without consequences of any sort nor does it mean that you automatically get an audience for it.
    - NeverFade 4y ago
      Let's start by defining what Free Speech isn't. There is no Free Speech if you can't speak freely where speech is actually happening. So if nearly all speech is moving online to massive social media sites, and you can't speak there freely, but instead your speech is subject to the whims of random employees - there is no Free Speech in this situation. > It certainly doesn't mean speech without consequences of any sort nor does it mean that you automatically get an audience for it. But it does mean you can speak. Even if there may be consequences, and even if you don't automatically get an audience. That's the right I'm supporting here, against an alarmingly large group that seems to consider this right to be no longer necessary, and even undesirable.
      - wvenable 4y ago
        Before the Internet, where was nearly all speech actually happening?
    - junofan 4y ago
      That’s not the definition of free speech in the US. The reason you should care is that your definition is likely to produce a free speech absolutist counter-movement.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

themitigating 4y ago

Why?

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
NeverFade 4y ago
If you're not protecting free speech in the places where free speech actually happens, then you are not protecting free speech at all. If speech has shifted online, to massive social media websites like Twitter, and you don't protect it there, then you have no free speech in your country.
- themitigating 4y ago
  There's no protection for free speech in the US only that the government can't make laws restricting it
  - NeverFade 4y ago
    Freedom of Expression is a core value in the US: > Freedom of speech, of the press, of association, of assembly and petition -- this set of guarantees, protected by the First Amendment, comprises what we refer to as freedom of expression. The Supreme Court has written that this freedom is "the matrix, the indispensable condition of nearly every other form of freedom." Without it, other fundamental rights, like the right to vote, would wither and die. https://www.aclu.org/other/freedom-expression https://www.aclu.org/other/freedom-expression As expression increasingly moves online, we will have to find ways to protect it online. A future in which the vast majority of speech happens in private online platforms, that may curtail it at will, is not just dystopian but goes against core American values, and the essence of freedom.
    - themitigating 4y ago
      This is not in the constitution, you just pasted the opinions of others. Core american values? There's massive censorship of pornography, there are noise laws, library books are being challanged and removed. A town voted to defund a library because they wouldn't remove a book. Explain to me how it's a core value?
- wvenable 4y ago
  Perhaps the problem is the definition of free speech. Free speech is you can't go to jail for what you say. It certainly doesn't mean speech without consequences of any sort nor does it mean that you automatically get an audience for it.
  - NeverFade 4y ago
    Let's start by defining what Free Speech isn't. There is no Free Speech if you can't speak freely where speech is actually happening. So if nearly all speech is moving online to massive social media sites, and you can't speak there freely, but instead your speech is subject to the whims of random employees - there is no Free Speech in this situation. > It certainly doesn't mean speech without consequences of any sort nor does it mean that you automatically get an audience for it. But it does mean you can speak. Even if there may be consequences, and even if you don't automatically get an audience. That's the right I'm supporting here, against an alarmingly large group that seems to consider this right to be no longer necessary, and even undesirable.
    - wvenable 4y ago
      Before the Internet, where was nearly all speech actually happening?
  - junofan 4y ago
    That’s not the definition of free speech in the US. The reason you should care is that your definition is likely to produce a free speech absolutist counter-movement.