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The famous fox domestication experiment that was carried out successfully in Russia over 40 years [1], shows how many generations it takes (40) and what genetic

The famous fox domestication experiment that was carried out successfully in Russia over 40 years [1], shows how many generations it takes (40) and what genetic changes occur during domestication. What I also want to add is that some dog breeders in the late 19th century thought that introducing wolf genes into dog breeds would make better dogs. They ended up creating horrible dog breeds (that still exist) that have the shyness, anxiety, and distrust of wolves. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domesticated_silver_fox https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domesticated_silver_fox

dfc 4y ago
Do you know any of the 19th century experimental breeds that still exist?
- lynguist 4y ago
  Two famous examples: - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saarloos_wolfdog https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saarloos_wolfdog The goal here was to recreate a fictional original German Aryan dog, untainted by modern degeneracy. The breeder thought to recreate the original heroic character by introducing the wolf into the breed, resulting in unbalanced, untrainable hybrids. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czechoslovakian_Wolfdog https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czechoslovakian_Wolfdog This was supposed to be another version of a better German Shepherd, better suited to the mountains. The result was the same as above. The takeaway message is that every dog breed has its purpose, and that its character is inherited. There are dangerous dog breeds just bred to kill dogs or bulls (pit bull terrier). Some dog breeds were created without regard for the dog’s physiology (pug). Others were created without taking into account the temperament.
h2odragon 4y ago
"wolf crossbreeds" are still a thing. Most of the time people have a "part wolf" husky they're breeding from and what they're selling is huskies with slightly more varied coats; but there's still 50% crosbreeds being raised by some folks. Neighbor of mine brings his out to the flea market sometimes for socialization; when he hits the lot every real dog there knows it, and is upset about it. The wolfdog is very polite, and on a chain, the domestic dogs don't like his smell.
wingineer 4y ago
Can you provide a source re:19th century dog breeding with wolf genes? Very curious!
- lynguist 4y ago
  I answered a sibling comment just now.
feintruled 4y ago
Indeed, I had heard of that fascinating experiment. But I assume they were working from the prior example of domesticating wolves - I was wondering how you would get the idea of doing it with no prior example. From my research (*cough* YouTube *cough*) I can see that even a wild wolf pup can be tamed to a fair degree, and one person trying this experiment - maybe he killed the mother and raised the pup for amusement say - this singular experiment could have kickstarted the whole domestication arc. Seems more likely to me than someone having a long term plan to domesticate, or wolves accidentally slowly domesticating themselves by scavenging food from human settlements. I am no expert in this matter though.

dfc 4y ago

Do you know any of the 19th century experimental breeds that still exist?

lynguist 4y ago
Two famous examples: - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saarloos_wolfdog https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saarloos_wolfdog The goal here was to recreate a fictional original German Aryan dog, untainted by modern degeneracy. The breeder thought to recreate the original heroic character by introducing the wolf into the breed, resulting in unbalanced, untrainable hybrids. - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czechoslovakian_Wolfdog https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czechoslovakian_Wolfdog This was supposed to be another version of a better German Shepherd, better suited to the mountains. The result was the same as above. The takeaway message is that every dog breed has its purpose, and that its character is inherited. There are dangerous dog breeds just bred to kill dogs or bulls (pit bull terrier). Some dog breeds were created without regard for the dog’s physiology (pug). Others were created without taking into account the temperament.

h2odragon 4y ago

"wolf crossbreeds" are still a thing. Most of the time people have a "part wolf" husky they're breeding from and what they're selling is huskies with slightly more varied coats; but there's still 50% crosbreeds being raised by some folks. Neighbor of mine brings his out to the flea market sometimes for socialization; when he hits the lot every real dog there knows it, and is upset about it. The wolfdog is very polite, and on a chain, the domestic dogs don't like his smell.

wingineer 4y ago

Can you provide a source re:19th century dog breeding with wolf genes? Very curious!

lynguist 4y ago
I answered a sibling comment just now.

feintruled 4y ago

Indeed, I had heard of that fascinating experiment. But I assume they were working from the prior example of domesticating wolves - I was wondering how you would get the idea of doing it with no prior example. From my research (*cough* YouTube *cough*) I can see that even a wild wolf pup can be tamed to a fair degree, and one person trying this experiment - maybe he killed the mother and raised the pup for amusement say - this singular experiment could have kickstarted the whole domestication arc. Seems more likely to me than someone having a long term plan to domesticate, or wolves accidentally slowly domesticating themselves by scavenging food from human settlements. I am no expert in this matter though.