6 ms·

Cheating hurts innocent online gamers. Piracy hurts game developers/publishers. If you want a device you can hack, buy a PC (or a Steam Deck).

bitwize 4y ago
If you want a device you can hack, don't play games on it. Within a few years, Pluton will give us airtight anticheat.
- sudosysgen 4y ago
  Untrue. An HDMI capture card, image recognition, and a USB HID device means easy aimbot. Anti-cheat is an impossible task.
- ekianjo 4y ago
  You are in for a big surprise if you think you can airtight anticheat. Never going to happen.
  - google234123 4y ago
    You can get pretty close though: see esea or Riot's Valorant
- Cloudef 4y ago
  You mean pluton is going to give us a smartphone kind of locked ecosystem disguised as a PC. https://secret.club/2021/06/28/windows11-tpms.html https://secret.club/2021/06/28/windows11-tpms.html
EMIRELADERO 4y ago
Is it really true that piracy hurts game developers? All I've seen is evidence for the contrary[1] As for your end statement, I believe having root access, or just the same level of control over the individual device as the manufacturer does after the sale, is a matter of consumer rights/protections ripe for legislation, not about "features". [1] https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/09/eu-study-finds-piracy-doesnt-hurt-game-sales-may-actually-help/ https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/09/eu-study-finds-piracy...
- thrdbndndn 4y ago
  I totally get that piracy may not necessarily hurt dev in term of income. But I feel a few other things always seem to be left out in the discussion about this topic. 1) it is totally unfair for the honest buyers if other people can get it for free in an "illegal" way. 2) The IP holders may simply don't want people to get there work for free, irrespective of the fact "they are not going to buy it anyway!". I've seen lots of indie artists express such opinion. Ultimately, I don't think that's something bystanders have a say. You (general you, not "you" you) can't force your "rational analysis on economy of privacy" on the IP holders. Large game companies obviously almost only care about the profit, so you may assume they think that way. But that can't be applied to everyone.
  - EMIRELADERO 4y ago
    > 1) it is totally unfair for the honest buyers if other people can get it for free in an "illegal" way. I have never, ever seen anyone make that argument. How would that even work? "I paid fof this Smart TV. Then I heard about a massive shoplifting operation that took place on the store I bought it from. Damn! Why did I have to pay when those thiefs got many for free!". Doesn't hold up. > 2) The IP holders may simply don't want people to get there work for free, irrespective of the fact "they are not going to buy it anyway!". I've seen lots of indie artists express such opinion. What would the motivation for not wanting them to get it for free be, then? Unless you don't want people to get your works in the first place. If you do, I don't see how piracy might make you angry without the "concern over potentially lost sales" element.
    - thrdbndndn 4y ago
      >I have never, ever seen anyone make that argument Well, now you see one, I am making it. Your analogy with tangible goods doesn't work. Shoplifting, or stealing, could be a felony and is heavily frown upon morally. The risk of getting caught up is much higher, and the consequence is more serious. I won't be angry about "thieves getting them for free" despite I paid for the TV, because I knew they will end up in jails eventually, if not already. Piracy, while theoretically illegal, is almost never punished. It realistically has no risk. So there are a lot more people doing that than shoplifting. And yes, I feel salty when I paid full price for X game while someone is getting it free. >What would the motivation for not wanting them to get it for free be, then? Unless you don't want people to get your works in the first place. I only want my paid customers to get it, whoever doesn't pay doesn't deserve to get it. Pretty simple. I don't find it's hard to understand. Go ask any artist live with Patreon money how they feel about it.
bakugo 4y ago
>Cheating hurts innocent online gamers. Vast majority of people hack their consoles to pirate or run homebrew, not cheat. Consoles are usually only hackable on non-current firmwares anyway which means no online play. >Piracy hurts game developers/publishers. This has been disproven countless times.
- wildzzz 4y ago
  I don't believe that in the slightest. Sure, you do have to usually run some homebrew code to be able to play ripped copies of retail games but how big is the homebrew game and app market (other than XBMC for Xbox) that people would opt for that and not pirated games? Being able to compile code for a game console is usually (excluding XDK for the old Xbox) much more difficult than obtaining ripped retail games. Every modded console I ever saw in-person had a hardrive or stack of discs of pirated games. Games are pretty expensive and are a luxury in many parts of the world so there's a massive motive behind being able to run region-free pirated games on consoles. This argument is like saying that most people with torrent clients only download Linux ISOs and creative Commons licensed content. If the ability to pirate content is there, most people are going to do it.

bitwize 4y ago

If you want a device you can hack, don't play games on it. Within a few years, Pluton will give us airtight anticheat.

sudosysgen 4y ago
Untrue. An HDMI capture card, image recognition, and a USB HID device means easy aimbot. Anti-cheat is an impossible task.
ekianjo 4y ago
You are in for a big surprise if you think you can airtight anticheat. Never going to happen.
- google234123 4y ago
  You can get pretty close though: see esea or Riot's Valorant
Cloudef 4y ago
You mean pluton is going to give us a smartphone kind of locked ecosystem disguised as a PC. https://secret.club/2021/06/28/windows11-tpms.html https://secret.club/2021/06/28/windows11-tpms.html

EMIRELADERO 4y ago

Is it really true that piracy hurts game developers? All I've seen is evidence for the contrary[1] As for your end statement, I believe having root access, or just the same level of control over the individual device as the manufacturer does after the sale, is a matter of consumer rights/protections ripe for legislation, not about "features". [1] https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/09/eu-study-finds-piracy-doesnt-hurt-game-sales-may-actually-help/ https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/09/eu-study-finds-piracy...

thrdbndndn 4y ago
I totally get that piracy may not necessarily hurt dev in term of income. But I feel a few other things always seem to be left out in the discussion about this topic. 1) it is totally unfair for the honest buyers if other people can get it for free in an "illegal" way. 2) The IP holders may simply don't want people to get there work for free, irrespective of the fact "they are not going to buy it anyway!". I've seen lots of indie artists express such opinion. Ultimately, I don't think that's something bystanders have a say. You (general you, not "you" you) can't force your "rational analysis on economy of privacy" on the IP holders. Large game companies obviously almost only care about the profit, so you may assume they think that way. But that can't be applied to everyone.
- EMIRELADERO 4y ago
  > 1) it is totally unfair for the honest buyers if other people can get it for free in an "illegal" way. I have never, ever seen anyone make that argument. How would that even work? "I paid fof this Smart TV. Then I heard about a massive shoplifting operation that took place on the store I bought it from. Damn! Why did I have to pay when those thiefs got many for free!". Doesn't hold up. > 2) The IP holders may simply don't want people to get there work for free, irrespective of the fact "they are not going to buy it anyway!". I've seen lots of indie artists express such opinion. What would the motivation for not wanting them to get it for free be, then? Unless you don't want people to get your works in the first place. If you do, I don't see how piracy might make you angry without the "concern over potentially lost sales" element.
  - thrdbndndn 4y ago
    >I have never, ever seen anyone make that argument Well, now you see one, I am making it. Your analogy with tangible goods doesn't work. Shoplifting, or stealing, could be a felony and is heavily frown upon morally. The risk of getting caught up is much higher, and the consequence is more serious. I won't be angry about "thieves getting them for free" despite I paid for the TV, because I knew they will end up in jails eventually, if not already. Piracy, while theoretically illegal, is almost never punished. It realistically has no risk. So there are a lot more people doing that than shoplifting. And yes, I feel salty when I paid full price for X game while someone is getting it free. >What would the motivation for not wanting them to get it for free be, then? Unless you don't want people to get your works in the first place. I only want my paid customers to get it, whoever doesn't pay doesn't deserve to get it. Pretty simple. I don't find it's hard to understand. Go ask any artist live with Patreon money how they feel about it.

bakugo 4y ago

>Cheating hurts innocent online gamers. Vast majority of people hack their consoles to pirate or run homebrew, not cheat. Consoles are usually only hackable on non-current firmwares anyway which means no online play. >Piracy hurts game developers/publishers. This has been disproven countless times.

wildzzz 4y ago
I don't believe that in the slightest. Sure, you do have to usually run some homebrew code to be able to play ripped copies of retail games but how big is the homebrew game and app market (other than XBMC for Xbox) that people would opt for that and not pirated games? Being able to compile code for a game console is usually (excluding XDK for the old Xbox) much more difficult than obtaining ripped retail games. Every modded console I ever saw in-person had a hardrive or stack of discs of pirated games. Games are pretty expensive and are a luxury in many parts of the world so there's a massive motive behind being able to run region-free pirated games on consoles. This argument is like saying that most people with torrent clients only download Linux ISOs and creative Commons licensed content. If the ability to pirate content is there, most people are going to do it.