4 ms·

They're degrees of the same thing. In my experience companies don't want to know about it if at all possible. In some cases working on a vacation is a more ser

They're degrees of the same thing. In my experience companies don't want to know about it if at all possible. In some cases working on a vacation is a more serious issue - I have heard stories of employees remote working from sanctioned countries and employers finding out after the fact.

NovemberWhiskey 4y ago
>They're degrees of the same thing. No; they're not. Intention often matters in immigration. If the purpose of your stay in a country is tourism, that is one thing. If the purpose of your stay is to work remotely then that is a different thing.
- throwaway09223 4y ago
  We are talking about situations where the purpose is to work remotely on vacation. This is an extremely common scenario. As I said, it is a matter of degree.
  - NovemberWhiskey 4y ago
    Your original reply was to a post saying: Sending an email on vacation is one thing. Setting up residency is something else entirely. Those do not have the same intention. In the first case, the email is incidental to the vacation. In the second case, the purpose is to work (which defies the claim to be "on vacation" in the first place). No-one is confused about whether they're going on a foreign vacation (taking vacation time, telling their colleagues they're not going to be available etc) and handling a few emails vs. setting out to work remotely from another country that might have a superior climate. The suggestion that these are the same thing based on observing that both involve work email in a foreign country is pretty obviously ridiculous. If you tell the immigration officer at the border that you're planning to work remotely with your tourist visa, they're going to put you on the first plane home.
    - throwaway09223 4y ago
      It sounds like you agree that these are all matters of degree. I don't see anything in your post that is in disagreement with what I said above.
kube-system 4y ago
Yea, sending an email can be a big issue depending on the circumstances. But lying about full time residency is always a big issue.
- throwaway09223 4y ago
  Of course. My point is that it's typically not a cloak and dagger situation described above, with an employee going to great technical lengths to hide their whereabouts. Generally speaking, the immediate manager is aware and is pursuing a policy of willful ignorance. Often when rumors percolate to HR, HR will very quietly say that they don't want to know and to clean it up so they don't ever have to. I don't know of any companies attempting to actively document this kind of thing. They don't want to know, and they'll only respond if they are forced to acknowledge the situation.
  - kube-system 4y ago
    Potentially the case, but this article was about two people who were going to great lengths to hide their whereabouts from their employers. > I don't know of any companies attempting to actively document this kind of thing. Well, not all companies tolerate casual lies, especially those that impact tax liability. At my organization, you'd be terminated for any willful lie in an instant based solely on a violation of trust... even if it didn't open the company to any tax or legal liability.
    - throwaway09223 4y ago
      Certainly the official policy is that you'll be terminated. Almost every HR department would say this if asked. Reality is often different. Companies are diverse collections of many different people with a diversity of incentives who all enforce policies in very different ways. When these things happen there are many layers of management who will more often than not try to avoid the problem.
      - kube-system 4y ago

NovemberWhiskey 4y ago

>They're degrees of the same thing. No; they're not. Intention often matters in immigration. If the purpose of your stay in a country is tourism, that is one thing. If the purpose of your stay is to work remotely then that is a different thing.

throwaway09223 4y ago
We are talking about situations where the purpose is to work remotely on vacation. This is an extremely common scenario. As I said, it is a matter of degree.
- NovemberWhiskey 4y ago
  Your original reply was to a post saying: Sending an email on vacation is one thing. Setting up residency is something else entirely. Those do not have the same intention. In the first case, the email is incidental to the vacation. In the second case, the purpose is to work (which defies the claim to be "on vacation" in the first place). No-one is confused about whether they're going on a foreign vacation (taking vacation time, telling their colleagues they're not going to be available etc) and handling a few emails vs. setting out to work remotely from another country that might have a superior climate. The suggestion that these are the same thing based on observing that both involve work email in a foreign country is pretty obviously ridiculous. If you tell the immigration officer at the border that you're planning to work remotely with your tourist visa, they're going to put you on the first plane home.
  - throwaway09223 4y ago
    It sounds like you agree that these are all matters of degree. I don't see anything in your post that is in disagreement with what I said above.

kube-system 4y ago

Yea, sending an email can be a big issue depending on the circumstances. But lying about full time residency is always a big issue.

throwaway09223 4y ago
Of course. My point is that it's typically not a cloak and dagger situation described above, with an employee going to great technical lengths to hide their whereabouts. Generally speaking, the immediate manager is aware and is pursuing a policy of willful ignorance. Often when rumors percolate to HR, HR will very quietly say that they don't want to know and to clean it up so they don't ever have to. I don't know of any companies attempting to actively document this kind of thing. They don't want to know, and they'll only respond if they are forced to acknowledge the situation.
- kube-system 4y ago
  Potentially the case, but this article was about two people who were going to great lengths to hide their whereabouts from their employers. > I don't know of any companies attempting to actively document this kind of thing. Well, not all companies tolerate casual lies, especially those that impact tax liability. At my organization, you'd be terminated for any willful lie in an instant based solely on a violation of trust... even if it didn't open the company to any tax or legal liability.
  - throwaway09223 4y ago
    Certainly the official policy is that you'll be terminated. Almost every HR department would say this if asked. Reality is often different. Companies are diverse collections of many different people with a diversity of incentives who all enforce policies in very different ways. When these things happen there are many layers of management who will more often than not try to avoid the problem.
    - kube-system 4y ago