4 ms·

Sadly outside of FAANG this is not the case at all. Total compensation out of non-faang is: Salary + worthless stock option and maybe a 3% 401k match if they're

Sadly outside of FAANG this is not the case at all. Total compensation out of non-faang is: Salary + worthless stock option and maybe a 3% 401k match if they're more than 5 years old.

brandall10 4y ago
There's many companies that compete for FAANG talent and pay that type of comp or come within 15% or so of it. Just peruse levels.fyi
- IaacForHire 4y ago
  I'm not sure I can believe that. The companies who hire for average senior engineers like me do not compete with FAANG. They hire the 90% of us who aren't rockstars and have accepted we have no upward mobility in our careers. I know very many devops/software engineers in San Francisco making $140k-$150k total comp.
  - brandall10 4y ago
    Sure, the vast majority do. But to say that only a small handful of companies pay this is just untrue... it's probably in the high double or even triple digits. Many namebrand non-FAANG (ie. Linked-In, Uber, Snap, Slack) do, and some you might not even think of. One example - OpenDoor, which pays over $400k for a regular senior engineer. Additionally, it's not uncommon for small NYC fintechs to pay straight cash comp of $350k+ for basic senior fullstack devs. All these places do the standard FAANG type interviews though. They're all competing for the same talent pool, and typically they're full of ex-FAANG engineers.
    - IaacForHire 4y ago
      I think you might slightly underestimate the sheer # of companies and tech jobs in the Bay Area? I think Hacker News is an echo chamber when it comes to this because there are so many "rockstar" type engineers here.
      - brandall10 4y ago
        Not arguing that 95% of companies don't. Just saying there are many outside the base FAANG camp that do... it's a much bigger ecosystem than one might expect at first blush. If you hang out on blind or get contacted by these companies over time it becomes evident.
        b112 4y ago
        What cracks me up, is how little a sub-200k salary is in SF. 100k less, in most other places on the planet, affords a much richer lifestyle. When I work in SV, I expect 2x the salary minimum, just due to the cost of living, and housing cost differences. Anything less than 300k? I'll make more working in Canada, at 150k.
        MikeTheRocker 4y ago
        This is just patently false. I live in SV and have pretty high living expenses, around $80-90k/year. If I were earning $300k, after 40% effective tax rate and CoL, I'd still save ~$100k. That's far more money in my pocket than the hypothetical Canadian employed me earning $150k, both nominally and especially so after the currency conversion.
      - belmarca 4y ago
        Probably. But there is worldwide demand for good developers, try looking into remote work. I've spoken with many people who have more than one "job", which amount to long, but not insane work weeks. One thing I think a lot of people underestimate is the sheer amount of _clueless_ (or almost clueless) software developers out there. There are a lot of young people with good intentions but very, very little "real" experience (writing a React web app for a class assignment isn't "real" except for saying you've tried the framework). Work experience is quite different from CompSci knowledge, evne if both are important! If you have even just 3-5 years of real experience building real systems with real failures and real successes, you should be quite easily employed elsewhere if your current job doesn't meet your expectations. Keep this in mind: we don't let surgeons operate alone before they have 5-6-7 years of _post-doctoral_ education and training. If you have the battle scars and experience to get a project done properly, you should be fine.
lrvick 4y ago
I have never worked at FAANG and had no problem making 200k+ at several companies doing webdev, sysadmin, and security over the last decade. Same for most of my friends. Now I do independent consulting so I get to set my own pay and < 40 hours which is worth more to me than maximal income, but if you want to make 500k+ a year you totally can without working adtech or FAANG especially if you are independent with niche skillsets.
- mxuribe 4y ago
  @lrvick My challenge with trying to leave my dayjob to do indie consulting has been finding my first, steady clients...at least enough to swap out for my dayjob. I have tried it the last few years as a side hustle, and while my tech and biz/ops skills are pretty good...my sales skills are not. Would you be willing to share how you got your clients, at least to the point of being able to live off of only your consulting work? (My email address is in my profile, if you wish to share less publicly.)
  - lrvick 4y ago
    Sure. Hit me up at @lrvick:matrix.org
  - primeblue 4y ago
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

Sadly outside of FAANG this is not the case at all. Total compensation out of non-faang is: Salary + worthless stock option and maybe a 3% 401k match if they're more than 5 years old.

brandall10 4y ago

There's many companies that compete for FAANG talent and pay that type of comp or come within 15% or so of it. Just peruse levels.fyi

IaacForHire 4y ago
I'm not sure I can believe that. The companies who hire for average senior engineers like me do not compete with FAANG. They hire the 90% of us who aren't rockstars and have accepted we have no upward mobility in our careers. I know very many devops/software engineers in San Francisco making $140k-$150k total comp.
- brandall10 4y ago
  Sure, the vast majority do. But to say that only a small handful of companies pay this is just untrue... it's probably in the high double or even triple digits. Many namebrand non-FAANG (ie. Linked-In, Uber, Snap, Slack) do, and some you might not even think of. One example - OpenDoor, which pays over $400k for a regular senior engineer. Additionally, it's not uncommon for small NYC fintechs to pay straight cash comp of $350k+ for basic senior fullstack devs. All these places do the standard FAANG type interviews though. They're all competing for the same talent pool, and typically they're full of ex-FAANG engineers.
  - IaacForHire 4y ago
    I think you might slightly underestimate the sheer # of companies and tech jobs in the Bay Area? I think Hacker News is an echo chamber when it comes to this because there are so many "rockstar" type engineers here.
    - brandall10 4y ago
      Not arguing that 95% of companies don't. Just saying there are many outside the base FAANG camp that do... it's a much bigger ecosystem than one might expect at first blush. If you hang out on blind or get contacted by these companies over time it becomes evident.
      - b112 4y ago
        What cracks me up, is how little a sub-200k salary is in SF. 100k less, in most other places on the planet, affords a much richer lifestyle. When I work in SV, I expect 2x the salary minimum, just due to the cost of living, and housing cost differences. Anything less than 300k? I'll make more working in Canada, at 150k.
        MikeTheRocker 4y ago
        This is just patently false. I live in SV and have pretty high living expenses, around $80-90k/year. If I were earning $300k, after 40% effective tax rate and CoL, I'd still save ~$100k. That's far more money in my pocket than the hypothetical Canadian employed me earning $150k, both nominally and especially so after the currency conversion.
    - belmarca 4y ago
      Probably. But there is worldwide demand for good developers, try looking into remote work. I've spoken with many people who have more than one "job", which amount to long, but not insane work weeks. One thing I think a lot of people underestimate is the sheer amount of _clueless_ (or almost clueless) software developers out there. There are a lot of young people with good intentions but very, very little "real" experience (writing a React web app for a class assignment isn't "real" except for saying you've tried the framework). Work experience is quite different from CompSci knowledge, evne if both are important! If you have even just 3-5 years of real experience building real systems with real failures and real successes, you should be quite easily employed elsewhere if your current job doesn't meet your expectations. Keep this in mind: we don't let surgeons operate alone before they have 5-6-7 years of _post-doctoral_ education and training. If you have the battle scars and experience to get a project done properly, you should be fine.

lrvick 4y ago

I have never worked at FAANG and had no problem making 200k+ at several companies doing webdev, sysadmin, and security over the last decade. Same for most of my friends. Now I do independent consulting so I get to set my own pay and < 40 hours which is worth more to me than maximal income, but if you want to make 500k+ a year you totally can without working adtech or FAANG especially if you are independent with niche skillsets.

mxuribe 4y ago
@lrvick My challenge with trying to leave my dayjob to do indie consulting has been finding my first, steady clients...at least enough to swap out for my dayjob. I have tried it the last few years as a side hustle, and while my tech and biz/ops skills are pretty good...my sales skills are not. Would you be willing to share how you got your clients, at least to the point of being able to live off of only your consulting work? (My email address is in my profile, if you wish to share less publicly.)
- lrvick 4y ago
  Sure. Hit me up at @lrvick:matrix.org
- primeblue 4y ago

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]