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America's self obsession hasn't prevented decades of war on countries that didn't do anything. What are you saying? American in order to save it's democracy th

America's self obsession hasn't prevented decades of war on countries that didn't do anything. What are you saying? American in order to save it's democracy they need to focus more outside? More?

justbored123 4y ago
graderjs 4y ago
Well the one's who are self-obsessed (Tony Stark, on Cap: "He's wrong, but he think's he's right: that makes him dangerous") can often be heavily involved in "helping" others so convinced they are of their own righteousness. But I think the article probably goes in a different direction to what we are saying (superficially? like a trope?) here. Let's read it! :P :) xx ;p
- graderjs 4y ago
  Alright, I'm reading it. It's a sad type of "hit piece" of turning something against Trump. But I think, separating out the anti-Trump craziness there may be something good there. I shall read on! :P ;) xx ;p (edits from now on, too many comments) edits: 1. Alright it seems like a pathetic "anti-authoritarian" hit piece, where you can get (the two threats of) Trump and China with one stone. As in: Democracy is at risk; yes, but it's not what you think; it's authoritarianism; Trump was authoritarian; hey, look over there, so is China. So far the article is BS, but I'm hoping there is some insight. 2. “Democracies can’t depend on one of two major parties never holding power,” argues Brendan Nyhan, a government professor at Dartmouth College and a co-founder of Bright Line Watch, a group that monitors the erosion of American democracy. But that may be the necessary treatment for now, because Republican leaders “are defining a vision of a Trumpist GOP that could prove more durable than the man himself.” Alright, this is some hope. We need more than just lip service to a two-party state. With each pretending the other is the antiChrist. That's the system, manipulating the people, to keep the "system" in power, the diametrically opposed parties are simply tools of the prolongation of that power. An illusion of choice. But sadly, so far that's as close as the article gets to what I see as truth, but I don't think they even meant it that way. 3. Wow, so got to the end of the article, and it's utter BS. Apparently the Republican Party and Trump represent the "cancer of authoritarianism". Which is just BS democrat posturing. I mean, how ridiculous, in the name of democracy, calling the only other legitimate party choice, the antichrist...while pretending you are upholding democracy by demonizing the only other choice people have? Insanity. Oh well. Most people are so triggered by these discussions as to make clear thought impossible. I hoped this article would contain some useful critique of Western liberal democracies failings, yet is was just a "status quo" hit piece dressed up in sophisticated garb. So sad. Don't drink it or you'll choke on that disgusting swap-water koolaid. blargh.
  - japhib 4y ago
    I mean … if you look at Jan. 6 and don’t think a successful version of it could happen in the future, you’re part of the problem. One of the two parties in America is actively pursuing a war on women’s rights, a war on LGBTQ rights, and a war on voting rights. And it’s not the Democrats. Look, I don’t think the Democrats are perfect, or even that good. But if you don’t think the Trump-fanatic core of the Republican Party is authoritarian, and heading towards fascism, you’re lying to yourself. Sure, the article is probably a bit overdramatic. Butthat doesn’t mean America doesn’t have a problem.
    - AnimalMuppet 4y ago
      I absolutely do not endorse the Trump Republicans' crazytown. But if you can't see that there's a lot of authoritarianism on the left as well, you are part of the problem. At the moment, there's much more of a threat from the right - an authoritarianism that's a much bigger part of the party's officeholders, voters, and party apparatus. At the moment. So don't sleep on the Democrats' potential for authoritarianism. It's there, even if latent. Worse, it may become more active, because "We have to fight off Trump! He's a threat to the existence of our democracy!" So they feel they have license to do anything necessary to win... (But the voters may not see it that way, or more precisely may not feel it that way. You vote twice every four years, but you go out of your house most days. Restrictions on what you can do, who you can meet with, and whether you have to mask felt more intrusive to many people than restrictions on voting rights. Or so I suspect.)
      - throwaway5959 4y ago
        I live in LA. Aside from certain areas of hospitals I can go anywhere without a mask on, even small, close quarter museums. Restrictions on what I can do? Please, the right is putting way more restrictions on what my wife and I can do than the left. I can’t think of anything more anti democratic than restricting the right to vote (especially when the same party works to make it easier to vote for the right “kind” of voter).
        4y ago
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

America's self obsession hasn't prevented decades of war on countries that didn't do anything. What are you saying? American in order to save it's democracy they need to focus more outside? More?

justbored123 4y ago

graderjs 4y ago

Well the one's who are self-obsessed (Tony Stark, on Cap: "He's wrong, but he think's he's right: that makes him dangerous") can often be heavily involved in "helping" others so convinced they are of their own righteousness. But I think the article probably goes in a different direction to what we are saying (superficially? like a trope?) here. Let's read it! :P :) xx ;p

graderjs 4y ago
Alright, I'm reading it. It's a sad type of "hit piece" of turning something against Trump. But I think, separating out the anti-Trump craziness there may be something good there. I shall read on! :P ;) xx ;p (edits from now on, too many comments) edits: 1. Alright it seems like a pathetic "anti-authoritarian" hit piece, where you can get (the two threats of) Trump and China with one stone. As in: Democracy is at risk; yes, but it's not what you think; it's authoritarianism; Trump was authoritarian; hey, look over there, so is China. So far the article is BS, but I'm hoping there is some insight. 2. “Democracies can’t depend on one of two major parties never holding power,” argues Brendan Nyhan, a government professor at Dartmouth College and a co-founder of Bright Line Watch, a group that monitors the erosion of American democracy. But that may be the necessary treatment for now, because Republican leaders “are defining a vision of a Trumpist GOP that could prove more durable than the man himself.” Alright, this is some hope. We need more than just lip service to a two-party state. With each pretending the other is the antiChrist. That's the system, manipulating the people, to keep the "system" in power, the diametrically opposed parties are simply tools of the prolongation of that power. An illusion of choice. But sadly, so far that's as close as the article gets to what I see as truth, but I don't think they even meant it that way. 3. Wow, so got to the end of the article, and it's utter BS. Apparently the Republican Party and Trump represent the "cancer of authoritarianism". Which is just BS democrat posturing. I mean, how ridiculous, in the name of democracy, calling the only other legitimate party choice, the antichrist...while pretending you are upholding democracy by demonizing the only other choice people have? Insanity. Oh well. Most people are so triggered by these discussions as to make clear thought impossible. I hoped this article would contain some useful critique of Western liberal democracies failings, yet is was just a "status quo" hit piece dressed up in sophisticated garb. So sad. Don't drink it or you'll choke on that disgusting swap-water koolaid. blargh.
- japhib 4y ago
  I mean … if you look at Jan. 6 and don’t think a successful version of it could happen in the future, you’re part of the problem. One of the two parties in America is actively pursuing a war on women’s rights, a war on LGBTQ rights, and a war on voting rights. And it’s not the Democrats. Look, I don’t think the Democrats are perfect, or even that good. But if you don’t think the Trump-fanatic core of the Republican Party is authoritarian, and heading towards fascism, you’re lying to yourself. Sure, the article is probably a bit overdramatic. Butthat doesn’t mean America doesn’t have a problem.
  - AnimalMuppet 4y ago
    I absolutely do not endorse the Trump Republicans' crazytown. But if you can't see that there's a lot of authoritarianism on the left as well, you are part of the problem. At the moment, there's much more of a threat from the right - an authoritarianism that's a much bigger part of the party's officeholders, voters, and party apparatus. At the moment. So don't sleep on the Democrats' potential for authoritarianism. It's there, even if latent. Worse, it may become more active, because "We have to fight off Trump! He's a threat to the existence of our democracy!" So they feel they have license to do anything necessary to win... (But the voters may not see it that way, or more precisely may not feel it that way. You vote twice every four years, but you go out of your house most days. Restrictions on what you can do, who you can meet with, and whether you have to mask felt more intrusive to many people than restrictions on voting rights. Or so I suspect.)
    - throwaway5959 4y ago
      I live in LA. Aside from certain areas of hospitals I can go anywhere without a mask on, even small, close quarter museums. Restrictions on what I can do? Please, the right is putting way more restrictions on what my wife and I can do than the left. I can’t think of anything more anti democratic than restricting the right to vote (especially when the same party works to make it easier to vote for the right “kind” of voter).
      - 4y ago

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]