4 ms·

Is there a good book that is similar in spirit, but doesn't require the maturity of GEB? I know an 8th grader that would be a great target, but I don't know if

Is there a good book that is similar in spirit, but doesn't require the maturity of GEB? I know an 8th grader that would be a great target, but I don't know if they have the mathematical/logical maturity to get through it.

pseudosudoer 4y ago
While I'm not sure it requires "less maturity", DH released a subsequent book titled "I am a strange loop" which is an attempt to condense his ideas from GEB.
squeaky-clean 4y ago
It depends on what you mean by "a similar spirit" I suppose. One thing Hofstadter didn't like about GEB was he felt too many people didn't see his central theme among the many other ideas there. His 2007 book, "I Am A Strange Loop" is a bit of an answer to this. It's mostly the same ideas in GEB about the self and strange loops, but without all the meandering and interludes. It's been a while but I remember it being less logic/mathy than GEB. I did enjoy it. But the meandering and the interludes are part of the enjoyment of GEB. So if you're looking for another book to capture that spirit of GEB, I'm drawing a blank, hopefully someone else knows one. Barely related recommendation, but I remember reading "A Brief History of Time" around that age. Very doable for a young teen if they have a passion for that sort of topic.
- denton-scratch 4y ago
  > people didn't see his central theme Ah - interesting. It took me several readings to tease-out what I thought the central theme was. As it happens, it led to a position that I objected to (and still object to). So discovering that central theme brought the book down a peg or two in my estimation. I still think it's one of the most entertaining books of popsci that I've ever opened.
stinkytaco 4y ago
Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance comes to mind immediately. It works on several levels and is very accessible as a result. If you wanted to stray from the spirit of GEB into narrative prose, there are a number of books I could recommend, especially in science fiction.
- Workaccount2 4y ago
  ZMM is a great philosophy intro book. It's captivating and will get you in that "deep thinking mode" while never getting too overly dense. The actual core philosophy is a bit meh, but it really doesn't matter since the book is loaded with general good insight. +1
  - phist_mcgee 4y ago
    I liked the book, but didn't like Pirsig in it. I felt sorry for him for sure, but i'm not sure I could understand him and his reasoning for things.
hypertexthero 4y ago
Think on These Things by Jiddu Krishnamurti
gsliepen 4y ago
I read the book for the first time at that age, and I definitely enjoyed it. While I knew some things were over my head, a lot of concepts are actually explained well enough that a 14 year old can grasp it, and the dialogues are a lot of fun.
Sharlin 4y ago
Sophie's World, which is about the history of Western philosophy (well, at least on one level. On another level, it's a story about a girl who starts to receive mysterious letters).
abecedarius 4y ago
Try Raymond Smullyan. He has books at a range of levels of accessibility; I'm not sure if there's anything great for your 8th grader, but I remember first getting into The Lady or the Tiger? as a teen.
- abrax3141 4y ago
  Smullyan's "Forever Undecided", and Ernest Nagel's "Gödel's Proof" are the best explanations available, to my mind. I find GEB to be bloated, if all that one is interested in is Gödel. (There is much more to recommend GEB, but if all you want is Gödel's proof, see one of the above.)
cfraenkel 4y ago
Not mathy, more where philosophy is coming from, but the books I remember from about the same timeframe as GED were Penrose's The Emperor's New Mind Timothy Ferris Coming of Age in the Milky Way and the Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, previously mentioned. Maybe not the most current thinking (but perfectly fine as an introduction), but the writing is more accessible than GED.
martopix 4y ago
I read GEB at about 18 and it changed my view of things. I loved it deeply and studied even the formulas. But not everyone is like that I guess. And even my self today wouldn't be.

pseudosudoer 4y ago

While I'm not sure it requires "less maturity", DH released a subsequent book titled "I am a strange loop" which is an attempt to condense his ideas from GEB.

squeaky-clean 4y ago

It depends on what you mean by "a similar spirit" I suppose. One thing Hofstadter didn't like about GEB was he felt too many people didn't see his central theme among the many other ideas there. His 2007 book, "I Am A Strange Loop" is a bit of an answer to this. It's mostly the same ideas in GEB about the self and strange loops, but without all the meandering and interludes. It's been a while but I remember it being less logic/mathy than GEB. I did enjoy it. But the meandering and the interludes are part of the enjoyment of GEB. So if you're looking for another book to capture that spirit of GEB, I'm drawing a blank, hopefully someone else knows one. Barely related recommendation, but I remember reading "A Brief History of Time" around that age. Very doable for a young teen if they have a passion for that sort of topic.

denton-scratch 4y ago
> people didn't see his central theme Ah - interesting. It took me several readings to tease-out what I thought the central theme was. As it happens, it led to a position that I objected to (and still object to). So discovering that central theme brought the book down a peg or two in my estimation. I still think it's one of the most entertaining books of popsci that I've ever opened.

stinkytaco 4y ago

Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance comes to mind immediately. It works on several levels and is very accessible as a result. If you wanted to stray from the spirit of GEB into narrative prose, there are a number of books I could recommend, especially in science fiction.

Workaccount2 4y ago
ZMM is a great philosophy intro book. It's captivating and will get you in that "deep thinking mode" while never getting too overly dense. The actual core philosophy is a bit meh, but it really doesn't matter since the book is loaded with general good insight. +1
- phist_mcgee 4y ago
  I liked the book, but didn't like Pirsig in it. I felt sorry for him for sure, but i'm not sure I could understand him and his reasoning for things.

hypertexthero 4y ago

Think on These Things by Jiddu Krishnamurti

gsliepen 4y ago

I read the book for the first time at that age, and I definitely enjoyed it. While I knew some things were over my head, a lot of concepts are actually explained well enough that a 14 year old can grasp it, and the dialogues are a lot of fun.

Sharlin 4y ago

Sophie's World, which is about the history of Western philosophy (well, at least on one level. On another level, it's a story about a girl who starts to receive mysterious letters).

abecedarius 4y ago

Try Raymond Smullyan. He has books at a range of levels of accessibility; I'm not sure if there's anything great for your 8th grader, but I remember first getting into The Lady or the Tiger? as a teen.

abrax3141 4y ago
Smullyan's "Forever Undecided", and Ernest Nagel's "Gödel's Proof" are the best explanations available, to my mind. I find GEB to be bloated, if all that one is interested in is Gödel. (There is much more to recommend GEB, but if all you want is Gödel's proof, see one of the above.)

cfraenkel 4y ago

Not mathy, more where philosophy is coming from, but the books I remember from about the same timeframe as GED were Penrose's The Emperor's New Mind Timothy Ferris Coming of Age in the Milky Way and the Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, previously mentioned. Maybe not the most current thinking (but perfectly fine as an introduction), but the writing is more accessible than GED.

martopix 4y ago

I read GEB at about 18 and it changed my view of things. I loved it deeply and studied even the formulas. But not everyone is like that I guess. And even my self today wouldn't be.