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Eveyone knows somebody that almost died after a week of trying veganism. You can take a look at the major killer diseases reasons and see how a diet that “requi

Eveyone knows somebody that almost died after a week of trying veganism. You can take a look at the major killer diseases reasons and see how a diet that “requires much less planning” works for the majority. What are those “expensive dietary supplements”?

adrian_b 4y ago
For example, by weight I eat almost only vegan food. Nevertheless, I make 2 exceptions from 100% vegan food. I typically eat daily around 50 grams of chicken liver and one spoon of cod liver oil, which provide all the organic substances that are not available or available in too small quantities in vegetables, e.g. vitamin B12, vitamin D, EPA, DHA, choline, taurine. There are vegan supplements for all those substances, but they would indeed cost more per day than all the food that I eat normally. Even if I could afford that, I would consider that as an irrational choice. For example, non-animal sources of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids cost about 8 times more than fish oil (per fatty acid content). The cod liver oil costs me about $0.60 per day, so a vegan supplement would be about $4.80 per day. Where I live, in Europe, all the food that I eat in a day costs me normally no more than $5 per day, so already only one of the vegan supplements would cost as much as the current complete daily meals. Moreover, previously I was making an extra exception and I was taking most of my protein intake from turkey breast or chicken breast. With the proteins provided by food that was almost pure animal protein, there was a considerable freedom in choosing all the other food sources. However, removing meat from the diet makes it extremely difficult to eat enough proteins without exceeding the daily energy intake for a sedentary life, unless you are willing to waste money by buying plant protein extracts that are much more expensive than meat. While I have found a combination that provides enough proteins without providing too much calories, it does not have any degree of freedom, so removing meat from the diet has forced the introduction of a fixed part of the diet that cannot be easily changed from day to day, for more variety.
- FeistySkink 4y ago
  I get vegan omega 3 for something like €35 for 180 capsules. That's roughly 20 cents per day. I don't know where you get those numbers from.
  - neuralRiot 4y ago
    Same here, i get 180 days supply of a multi-V that includes B12 for $20 USD and i take it because i’m a gym rat. The liver is where all toxins and mercury are more concentrated so I don’t know how good of an idea is eating it as a “supplement”.
    - adrian_b 4y ago
      There are public reports with the results of randomized searches for mercury in various fish oil and fish liver oil products. The results have always been that the mercury concentrations were lower than in other fish products, e.g. whole fish or fish filet. Regarding liver, e.g. chicken liver, as containing concentrated toxins, that is a myth. The liver is not a storage place for toxins. The liver is an organ that takes toxins from the blood that passes through it and then destroys them, typically by oxidation. Immediately after a meal that happens to contain very high quantities of undesirable substances, there will be a time interval when the liver will indeed contain higher concentrations of those. For example after a heavy drinking, for some hours the liver will contain more alcohol, until it is oxidized. However, after a long enough time since the last meal, the liver will contain less quantities of toxins than most other parts of the body, because they are destroyed soon after taking them from the blood, which other organs cannot do. The domestic animals that are killed for meat are typically slaughtered after some fasting time, so a higher level of toxins in the liver than in other parts is unlikely.
      - neuralRiot 4y ago
        Fish get omega-3 from algae which comes as a supplement too, so why not skipping the fish altogether? To me taking fish oil for the omega-3 seems like eating mud for the water.
  - adrian_b 4y ago
    There are good chances that you have not read the fine print about that vegan omega 3. The first time when I have seen vegan omega 3 supplements, I have also been fooled into thinking that they are not much more expensive than fish oil, and I have bought some. After reading the fine print, I have discovered that their content in essential fatty acids was significantly lower than that of products based on fish oil and also significantly lower than for an adequate daily intake. This is a marketing trick to make their high price more palatable. That is why in my previous post I have mentioned that the vegan supplements are 8 times more expensive per content of essential fatty acids, because their price per capsule is made to appear low. The $4.80 per day is computed based on the recommended daily intakes for essential fatty acids, and not on the micro doses recommended by the manufacturers of omega-3 vegan supplements, in order to not scare their customers with the real high prices.

adrian_b 4y ago

For example, by weight I eat almost only vegan food. Nevertheless, I make 2 exceptions from 100% vegan food. I typically eat daily around 50 grams of chicken liver and one spoon of cod liver oil, which provide all the organic substances that are not available or available in too small quantities in vegetables, e.g. vitamin B12, vitamin D, EPA, DHA, choline, taurine. There are vegan supplements for all those substances, but they would indeed cost more per day than all the food that I eat normally. Even if I could afford that, I would consider that as an irrational choice. For example, non-animal sources of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids cost about 8 times more than fish oil (per fatty acid content). The cod liver oil costs me about $0.60 per day, so a vegan supplement would be about $4.80 per day. Where I live, in Europe, all the food that I eat in a day costs me normally no more than $5 per day, so already only one of the vegan supplements would cost as much as the current complete daily meals. Moreover, previously I was making an extra exception and I was taking most of my protein intake from turkey breast or chicken breast. With the proteins provided by food that was almost pure animal protein, there was a considerable freedom in choosing all the other food sources. However, removing meat from the diet makes it extremely difficult to eat enough proteins without exceeding the daily energy intake for a sedentary life, unless you are willing to waste money by buying plant protein extracts that are much more expensive than meat. While I have found a combination that provides enough proteins without providing too much calories, it does not have any degree of freedom, so removing meat from the diet has forced the introduction of a fixed part of the diet that cannot be easily changed from day to day, for more variety.

FeistySkink 4y ago
I get vegan omega 3 for something like €35 for 180 capsules. That's roughly 20 cents per day. I don't know where you get those numbers from.
- neuralRiot 4y ago
  Same here, i get 180 days supply of a multi-V that includes B12 for $20 USD and i take it because i’m a gym rat. The liver is where all toxins and mercury are more concentrated so I don’t know how good of an idea is eating it as a “supplement”.
  - adrian_b 4y ago
    There are public reports with the results of randomized searches for mercury in various fish oil and fish liver oil products. The results have always been that the mercury concentrations were lower than in other fish products, e.g. whole fish or fish filet. Regarding liver, e.g. chicken liver, as containing concentrated toxins, that is a myth. The liver is not a storage place for toxins. The liver is an organ that takes toxins from the blood that passes through it and then destroys them, typically by oxidation. Immediately after a meal that happens to contain very high quantities of undesirable substances, there will be a time interval when the liver will indeed contain higher concentrations of those. For example after a heavy drinking, for some hours the liver will contain more alcohol, until it is oxidized. However, after a long enough time since the last meal, the liver will contain less quantities of toxins than most other parts of the body, because they are destroyed soon after taking them from the blood, which other organs cannot do. The domestic animals that are killed for meat are typically slaughtered after some fasting time, so a higher level of toxins in the liver than in other parts is unlikely.
    - neuralRiot 4y ago
      Fish get omega-3 from algae which comes as a supplement too, so why not skipping the fish altogether? To me taking fish oil for the omega-3 seems like eating mud for the water.
- adrian_b 4y ago
  There are good chances that you have not read the fine print about that vegan omega 3. The first time when I have seen vegan omega 3 supplements, I have also been fooled into thinking that they are not much more expensive than fish oil, and I have bought some. After reading the fine print, I have discovered that their content in essential fatty acids was significantly lower than that of products based on fish oil and also significantly lower than for an adequate daily intake. This is a marketing trick to make their high price more palatable. That is why in my previous post I have mentioned that the vegan supplements are 8 times more expensive per content of essential fatty acids, because their price per capsule is made to appear low. The $4.80 per day is computed based on the recommended daily intakes for essential fatty acids, and not on the micro doses recommended by the manufacturers of omega-3 vegan supplements, in order to not scare their customers with the real high prices.