4 ms·

It is incredibly short sighted to say that the sum of the jobs created by a data center is the people reporting to work in the building. This data center likel

by balloot 15y ago

It is incredibly short sighted to say that the sum of the jobs created by a data center is the people reporting to work in the building. This data center likely created hundreds, if not thousands of jobs. It's just that most of them aren't in hicksville, NC. There are hardware engineers designing the facility, software engineers maintaining the software infrastructure, product managers scheming of ways to use Apple's cloud facilities, etc.

msbarnett 15y ago
> This data center likely created hundreds, if not thousands of jobs. It's just that most of them aren't in hicksville, NC. Well, yes. But it's worth taking note of the point that Governments subsidizing the creation of data centers in places like hicksville, NC with the idea that the jobs they create will become a huge boon to the local hicksville economy is fundamentally mistaken. Aside from a skeleton staff to main the facility, most of the work is, as you say, create for people who will never need to set foot in North Carolina. The local jobs aren't bad for Hicksville, but they don't justify the huge subsidies, and they aren't going to ever save hicksville from economic irrelevancy.
- balloot 15y ago
  Absolutely. But it appears that the fault falls clearly on the NC state government, which according to the article debated for less than a minute before awarding Apple $46 million in tax breaks. The irony is that Apple basically used Republicans' blind allegiance to Job Creators to get huge tax breaks that will allow them to hire hundreds of people in the Socialist tax-happy hellhole of California, where most of the best knowledge workers live.
- yummyfajitas 15y ago
  According to the article, the government didn't subsidize Apple. Town Manager William “Todd” Herms said Apple’s presence boosts the town’s tax base and helps it lower overall taxes... Apple benefits from reduced taxes, and the town gets 50% of something rather than 100% of nothing.
  - hackinthebochs 15y ago
    That quote seems more like political-speak than actual hard numbers. The article also said that the state government gave Apple $46 million in tax breaks, while local government cut their property taxes by 50 percent and personal taxes by 85 percent. I'm hard-pressed to see how the taxpayers aren't subsidizing this datacenter.
    - tlear 15y ago
      They gave Apple those breaks to get them to build the facility there. No breaks 0 revenue, breaks some other > 0 revenue.
      - msbarnett 15y ago
        Money is fungible; tax breaks are no different in function than charging the full tax rate but handing Apple a pile of cash equivalent to what they'd have saved with the tax break. It's a subsidy. The argument that they made more with the subsidy than they would have without it is separate from the idea that tax breaks don't amount to a subsidy (which was yummyfajitas assertion).

by balloot 15y ago

msbarnett 15y ago

> This data center likely created hundreds, if not thousands of jobs. It's just that most of them aren't in hicksville, NC. Well, yes. But it's worth taking note of the point that Governments subsidizing the creation of data centers in places like hicksville, NC with the idea that the jobs they create will become a huge boon to the local hicksville economy is fundamentally mistaken. Aside from a skeleton staff to main the facility, most of the work is, as you say, create for people who will never need to set foot in North Carolina. The local jobs aren't bad for Hicksville, but they don't justify the huge subsidies, and they aren't going to ever save hicksville from economic irrelevancy.

balloot 15y ago
Absolutely. But it appears that the fault falls clearly on the NC state government, which according to the article debated for less than a minute before awarding Apple $46 million in tax breaks. The irony is that Apple basically used Republicans' blind allegiance to Job Creators to get huge tax breaks that will allow them to hire hundreds of people in the Socialist tax-happy hellhole of California, where most of the best knowledge workers live.
yummyfajitas 15y ago
According to the article, the government didn't subsidize Apple. Town Manager William “Todd” Herms said Apple’s presence boosts the town’s tax base and helps it lower overall taxes... Apple benefits from reduced taxes, and the town gets 50% of something rather than 100% of nothing.
- hackinthebochs 15y ago
  That quote seems more like political-speak than actual hard numbers. The article also said that the state government gave Apple $46 million in tax breaks, while local government cut their property taxes by 50 percent and personal taxes by 85 percent. I'm hard-pressed to see how the taxpayers aren't subsidizing this datacenter.
  - tlear 15y ago
    They gave Apple those breaks to get them to build the facility there. No breaks 0 revenue, breaks some other > 0 revenue.
    - msbarnett 15y ago
      Money is fungible; tax breaks are no different in function than charging the full tax rate but handing Apple a pile of cash equivalent to what they'd have saved with the tax break. It's a subsidy. The argument that they made more with the subsidy than they would have without it is separate from the idea that tax breaks don't amount to a subsidy (which was yummyfajitas assertion).