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Even if the maps are basic, it would allow Amazon to jack up the prices for amazon.com queries from the same IP address if the place, say, is really big. iRobot

Even if the maps are basic, it would allow Amazon to jack up the prices for amazon.com queries from the same IP address if the place, say, is really big. iRobot app also encourages naming all areas in the house, so that too can be pretty telling. In fact, iRobot requires the access to the location services to initialize their iOS apps, so even without a map this would allow Amazon to link an IP address to the exact property. Creative abuse of this combo can go a very long way.

helen___keller 4y ago
Although I agree with the general concern > it would allow Amazon to jack up the prices for amazon.com queries from the same IP address if the place, say, is really big. Afaik this sort of airline-style price discrimination is not something amazon engages in ever. Maybe I’m misinformed
- dylan604 4y ago
  I think rather than misinformed, you just left out a word in your claim. If you added the word "yet", then it would seem more appropriate to me. If the advertising world believes that targeted ads are the holy grail, then why wouldn't retailers believe targeted pricing to be also be the holy grail?
  - helen___keller 4y ago
    Targeted pricing is the holy grail, it’s just normally done through market segmentation and targeted advertisement. My personal belief is that if Amazon tried what you’re suggesting, they’d be shooting themselves in the foot (lose any remaining customer trust, regulators would be all over them, and competitors like Walmart would use it to gain market share overnight). In fact I was really hoping you’d share an article describing Amazon doing this so I have justification to cancel prime, ha!
    - dylan604 4y ago
      Honestly, I was just going all 1984 on the concept. However, if Amazon was really wanting to do this, they already know the avg income on everyone of their customers that have an Amazon credit card. That would be the ultimate in targeted pricing. Not just Amazon, any store branded card.
- Mountain_Skies 4y ago
  They tried it before, it was quickly noticed, and they apologized. But since then, they've started doing it with Prime membership, offering some deals only to Prime members while everyone else pays full price. That's not quite the same thing but certainly is hanging out in the same neighborhood.
  - vntok 4y ago
    That's not the same thing at all. It's a whole service, advertising these benefits explicitely, for which you pay explicitely.
treis 4y ago
Because it needs Bluetooth and/or WiFi to connect to the vacuum. Those both require location privileges
- Zagill 4y ago
  Wait, what? An app can't get access to Bluetooth without also getting my location? That seems like a bit of an oversight
  - treis 4y ago
    Other way around. An app with Bluetooth/Wifi access can determine your approximate location by seeing what devices are nearby. So the OS asks you to grant location permissions since, in effect, that is what you're granting the app.
- MichaelCollins 4y ago
  Do you have neighbors? The Roomba may be able to connect to the internet even if you never give it your wifi password or pair it with your phone. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Sidewalk https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Sidewalk
  - treis 4y ago
    What does that have to do with requiring location services to configure the app?
    - MichaelCollins 4y ago
      It means they could eliminate that requirement but it wouldn't be a meaningful improvement to privacy, because the roomba would still know where it is.
coredog64 4y ago
Amazon has your shipping address. Given an address, I can get the size of your house, the number of floors, room distribution and price from a few API calls, no ML required.
- ghaff 4y ago
  I have a feeling that I lot of people don't appreciate the degree of information about them that is public as a matter of policy and law. It's cheaper and easier to obtain today than a few decades ago but much of it has long been public. Of course, availability through an API can greatly expand how the information is used but, for the most part, it's tricky to say that data is public but you have to make it painful to access.
  - vntok 4y ago
    Price discrimination based on home dimensions is illegal in Europe, so most people here are fine with some of their info landing on a publicly accessible cadastre database.

helen___keller 4y ago

Although I agree with the general concern > it would allow Amazon to jack up the prices for amazon.com queries from the same IP address if the place, say, is really big. Afaik this sort of airline-style price discrimination is not something amazon engages in ever. Maybe I’m misinformed

dylan604 4y ago
I think rather than misinformed, you just left out a word in your claim. If you added the word "yet", then it would seem more appropriate to me. If the advertising world believes that targeted ads are the holy grail, then why wouldn't retailers believe targeted pricing to be also be the holy grail?
- helen___keller 4y ago
  Targeted pricing is the holy grail, it’s just normally done through market segmentation and targeted advertisement. My personal belief is that if Amazon tried what you’re suggesting, they’d be shooting themselves in the foot (lose any remaining customer trust, regulators would be all over them, and competitors like Walmart would use it to gain market share overnight). In fact I was really hoping you’d share an article describing Amazon doing this so I have justification to cancel prime, ha!
  - dylan604 4y ago
    Honestly, I was just going all 1984 on the concept. However, if Amazon was really wanting to do this, they already know the avg income on everyone of their customers that have an Amazon credit card. That would be the ultimate in targeted pricing. Not just Amazon, any store branded card.
Mountain_Skies 4y ago
They tried it before, it was quickly noticed, and they apologized. But since then, they've started doing it with Prime membership, offering some deals only to Prime members while everyone else pays full price. That's not quite the same thing but certainly is hanging out in the same neighborhood.
- vntok 4y ago
  That's not the same thing at all. It's a whole service, advertising these benefits explicitely, for which you pay explicitely.

treis 4y ago

Because it needs Bluetooth and/or WiFi to connect to the vacuum. Those both require location privileges

Zagill 4y ago
Wait, what? An app can't get access to Bluetooth without also getting my location? That seems like a bit of an oversight
- treis 4y ago
  Other way around. An app with Bluetooth/Wifi access can determine your approximate location by seeing what devices are nearby. So the OS asks you to grant location permissions since, in effect, that is what you're granting the app.
MichaelCollins 4y ago
Do you have neighbors? The Roomba may be able to connect to the internet even if you never give it your wifi password or pair it with your phone. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Sidewalk https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Sidewalk
- treis 4y ago
  What does that have to do with requiring location services to configure the app?
  - MichaelCollins 4y ago
    It means they could eliminate that requirement but it wouldn't be a meaningful improvement to privacy, because the roomba would still know where it is.

coredog64 4y ago

Amazon has your shipping address. Given an address, I can get the size of your house, the number of floors, room distribution and price from a few API calls, no ML required.

ghaff 4y ago
I have a feeling that I lot of people don't appreciate the degree of information about them that is public as a matter of policy and law. It's cheaper and easier to obtain today than a few decades ago but much of it has long been public. Of course, availability through an API can greatly expand how the information is used but, for the most part, it's tricky to say that data is public but you have to make it painful to access.
- vntok 4y ago
  Price discrimination based on home dimensions is illegal in Europe, so most people here are fine with some of their info landing on a publicly accessible cadastre database.