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Serious counter-counter-point for anybody interested: HTTPS protects people from ISP-based MITM attacks. This by itself is more than enough reason to always use

Serious counter-counter-point for anybody interested: HTTPS protects people from ISP-based MITM attacks. This by itself is more than enough reason to always use HTTPS if your website can be accessed by other people, even if it is just a small little innocent static blob of HTML.

EGreg 4y ago
Can’t the ISP still know what site you are visiting?
- mholt 4y ago
  Not necessarily. That's a simple question with a complex answer. There's a lot of "ifs" and maybes and it depends a lot on how the site is set up internally.
- Graziano_M 4y ago
  That’s not really the point. Say the MITM just replaces the phone number with one of their own so that a potential client calls the wrong number and pays the wrong person.
ramblerman 4y ago
doesn't man in the middle only apply if there were forms or anything requiring user input. I.e. a portion of the website is real, but the user interaction is attacked with MITM. If the risk is that an ISP would spoof the entire website at AI, then that can be done regardless of HTTPS.
- xurukefi 4y ago
  > If the risk is that an ISP would spoof the entire website at AI, then that can be done regardless of HTTPS. No, an ISP cannot spoof a valid certificate for a website
otabdeveloper4 4y ago
> HTTPS protects people from ISP-based MITM attacks On the infinite list things to worry about, "ISP-based MITM attacks" ranks somewhere around "getting bitten by a shark while fighting a velociraptor" and "accidentally getting abducted by a UFO". Please, please, let's start solving real problems. P.S. I know about dishonest ISP's that try to inject ads into pages. Switch to a better ISP, problem solved.
- xurukefi 4y ago
  > Switch to a better ISP, problem solved. There are a lot of people in this world who can choose between exactly one ISP.
  - otabdeveloper4 4y ago
    There are a lot of people who can choose between exactly one supermarket. Should you equip everyone in the world with an e-coli tester? You know, it's super-easy for a supermarket employee to infect your food with e-coli! Some problems don't need a technical solution, okay?
    - paledot 4y ago
      In 2022, the strongest possible argument against using HTTPS is "it's not strictly necessary". That's it. It's not expensive, it's not hard, it's not slow. The worst case is you've done something unnecessary for most people (arguably). Yeah, if "e-coli testers" were free, easy to distribute, and consumed no resources, including them with every supermarket purchase would be a great idea.
      - Rudism 4y ago
        Also if it has been proven that, given a chance, many supermarkets have and still actively do inject e-coli into their foods because they are able to profit off of it somehow, then the "e-coli testers" would be an even better idea.
  - deleted 4y ago

EGreg 4y ago

Can’t the ISP still know what site you are visiting?

mholt 4y ago
Not necessarily. That's a simple question with a complex answer. There's a lot of "ifs" and maybes and it depends a lot on how the site is set up internally.
Graziano_M 4y ago
That’s not really the point. Say the MITM just replaces the phone number with one of their own so that a potential client calls the wrong number and pays the wrong person.

ramblerman 4y ago

doesn't man in the middle only apply if there were forms or anything requiring user input. I.e. a portion of the website is real, but the user interaction is attacked with MITM. If the risk is that an ISP would spoof the entire website at AI, then that can be done regardless of HTTPS.

xurukefi 4y ago
> If the risk is that an ISP would spoof the entire website at AI, then that can be done regardless of HTTPS. No, an ISP cannot spoof a valid certificate for a website

otabdeveloper4 4y ago

> HTTPS protects people from ISP-based MITM attacks On the infinite list things to worry about, "ISP-based MITM attacks" ranks somewhere around "getting bitten by a shark while fighting a velociraptor" and "accidentally getting abducted by a UFO". Please, please, let's start solving real problems. P.S. I know about dishonest ISP's that try to inject ads into pages. Switch to a better ISP, problem solved.

xurukefi 4y ago
> Switch to a better ISP, problem solved. There are a lot of people in this world who can choose between exactly one ISP.
- otabdeveloper4 4y ago
  There are a lot of people who can choose between exactly one supermarket. Should you equip everyone in the world with an e-coli tester? You know, it's super-easy for a supermarket employee to infect your food with e-coli! Some problems don't need a technical solution, okay?
  - paledot 4y ago
    In 2022, the strongest possible argument against using HTTPS is "it's not strictly necessary". That's it. It's not expensive, it's not hard, it's not slow. The worst case is you've done something unnecessary for most people (arguably). Yeah, if "e-coli testers" were free, easy to distribute, and consumed no resources, including them with every supermarket purchase would be a great idea.
    - Rudism 4y ago
      Also if it has been proven that, given a chance, many supermarkets have and still actively do inject e-coli into their foods because they are able to profit off of it somehow, then the "e-coli testers" would be an even better idea.
- deleted 4y ago