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What sort of circumstances would they use this parachute? Engine failure? In a spin?
by johntb86 4y ago
What sort of circumstances would they use this parachute? Engine failure? In a spin?
- _s 4y agoNearly always in the event of an engine failure or an unrecoverable attitude; which may be a spin. Cirrus’s transition training emphasises pulling the chute - the seats and airframe are designed to absorb the vertical impact and protect the people on board. Most other aircraft you learn to pick a field to glide into, or do spin / unusual attitude training to recover from them. The chute is essentially a get out of jail free card for when you don’t have the options for any of those things.
- Gracana 4y agoEngine failure, running out of fuel, stalls, spins, midair collisions, disorientation, etc. Cirrus has a history of CAPS deployments, linked in the article and copied here: https://www.cirruspilots.org/Safety/CAPS-Event-History https://www.cirruspilots.org/Safety/CAPS-Event-History
- hackitup7 4y agoVery impressive to see how many people were able to walk away from these incidents, I wonder what the counts of injury or worse would look like without this system? Also it seems like these small planes have a lot of incidents, I'm guessing due to relatively inexperienced pilots?
- bombcar 4y agoSmall plane pilots are generally “not as experienced as they could be” and so Cirrus pilots are trained “when in doubt pop it out” as you might be able to successfully crash land or make it to a landing field, but the chute doesn’t work below a certain altitude.
- AYBABTME 4y agoLots of ATP certified folks end up in NTSB reports. At some point, it boils down to smaller aircrafts being more at the mercy of weather.
- jandrese 4y agoThis incident looks like it may be one of those cases. The pilot was on the glide slope to the airport when he runs into a microburst and decides to pull the lever before getting pushed down into the lake.
- bombcar 4y agoNot sure the mechanics of a microburst that would prohibit the plane getting through but not push the plane and parachute into the lake.
- kayodelycaon 4y agoI’ve seen way too many episodes of Air Crash Investigations. A microburst could easily take out a full-sized airline at low altitude. That’s why airports and planes have equipment to detect air shear so they don’t fly into it. Small planes are far more affected by weather and don’t typical have radar or safety systems like flight envelope protection.
- bombcar 4y agoyeah but why would popping a parachute in a microburst protect you? The air would still be going down with you in it.
- marcinzm 4y ago>Also it seems like these small planes have a lot of incidents, I'm guessing due to relatively inexperienced pilots? There's also less redundancy in the plane overall so if something goes wrong it's more likely to lead to serious issues. A large commercial plane has multiple pilots, engines, power sources, control surface systems, computers, sensors, etc.
- bilsbie 4y agoAlso they fly above the weather and have more instruments.
- ehnto 4y agoGeneral Aviation/Private Aviation is as dangerous as riding a motorcycle, per hour of participation. At least the last time I checked the statistics. It might have improved with navigation technology and flight planning software becoming more affordable.
- merely-unlikely 4y agoA lot of GA aircraft are also decades old and lacking newer technology
- mechanical_bear 4y agoThe danger of riding a motorcycle is overstated, as those stats take into account riders who didn’t wear safety gear and/or rode inebriated.
- dhsysusbsjsi 4y agoYeah but to be fair, aviation statistics would also be 10% as bad if they excluded people who didn’t fly into bad weather, took off overweight, didn’t have enough fuel in the tanks, ran out of light or were too fatigued, or couldn’t say ‘no’ to tasking or an unserviceable aircraft.
- shostack 4y agoWhich is saying something given the level of training, testing, safety culture, licensing, and ATC coverage.
- NonNefarious 4y agoSmall planes are often flown under visual rules without a flight plan, meaning that pilots are free to basically dick around... with prohibitions against unauthorized entry into controlled airspace and flying too close to people and structures on the ground. And that's totally fine when done responsibly. But the free-form nature of the vehicle operation provides more opportunity for screw-ups. Maybe someone was buzzing his house or not paying attention to flying while giving a sightseeing tour to his friends. Compared to commercial flights, it's no wonder that GA has a far higher accident rate. Commercial flights fly extremely predictable and repetitive routes and procedures, which reduce the number of variables into the mission. I'd liken the comparison to that between personal cars and buses, except commercial air travel is even more regimented than bus travel.
- kylecordes 4y agoI am not a pilot, not even a little bit; But I was under the impression that pilot training has a lot of attention on recovery from a stall or spin, and unless at low altitude, those are generally recoverable (in a small aircraft). Would love for someone with actual knowledge to weigh in, thanks!
- ehnto 4y agoIt can take time and altitude to recover a spin, and low altitude maneuvers are often where unintentional spins occur. That said, I don't know what the minimum altitude for a parachute deployment is. That'd be important.
- atdrummond 4y agoI believe 2000 feet unless Cirrus has changed their recommendations.
- dhsysusbsjsi 4y agoIt’s 500ft in the flight manual
- krisoft 4y agoThere are no minumums per say. If you need it pull it. The higher you pull it the better it can work. They say the demonstrated parameters are: 400 feet in straight and level flight and 920 feet in spin. https://flyasg.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/CAPS_Guide.pdf https://flyasg.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/CAPS_Guide.p...
- melony 4y agoSmall plane PPL pilots are not always as experienced/well-trained as full time commercial airline pilots.
- cmurf 4y agoStall avoidance and recovery is mandatory training for certification, arguably mandatory training for make/model checkout even if there's no type rating required. Stall spin training is only required for flight instructor certification. While anyone can do this training, FARs require both instructor and student are wearing a parachute, unless it's for CFI training.
- heelix 4y agoYes to both, with the assumption a unpowered landing is not a better option. The straps are part of the air frame - so the parachute more or less turns this into something disposable. Spin recovery is tricky enough I don't believe they have a procedure that does not involve the shoot. A photo from the prop version, post deployment. You can see how the straps are embedded in. Neat system. https://i.imgur.com/L54qyE7.jpg https://i.imgur.com/L54qyE7.jpg
- petesergeant 4y agolet's say your wing detaches... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4a8cntPdRtk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4a8cntPdRtk