3 ms·

> I don’t hear anyone saying we’re running out of lead. Don't know much about materials science but is demand for lead expected to equal demand for lithium?

by jjcon 4y ago

saurik 4y ago
There is about the same weight of lead in a normal car with a lead acid battery as there is lithium in an EV, but I don't know how we are measuring the total available amount of both for that abundance as the weight of an atom of lead is like 30-35 times that of lithium.
- lelanthran 4y ago
  > There is about the same weight of lead in a normal car with a lead acid battery as there is lithium in an EV, but I don't know how we are measuring the total available amount of both for that abundance as the weight of an atom of lead is like 30-35 times that of lithium. This I never knew! Is there really only 3Kgs of lithium in a Tesla battery pack?
  - int_19h 4y ago
    Your typical car lead-acid battery has 8-10 kg of lead.
    - lelanthran 4y ago
      > Your typical car lead-acid battery has 8-10 kg of lead. I didn't think so - the full lead-acid battery itself weighs less than 10kg, and it appeared to me that about half of that weight was the solution (water). Even if true, though, still very surprised that a ~550kg EV battery has less than 10kg of lithium.
      - saurik 4y ago
        https://www.barrons.com/amp/articles/new-risk-tesla-other-electric-vehicle-makers-lithium-supply-batteries-51601498472 https://www.barrons.com/amp/articles/new-risk-tesla-other-el... > a single EV has roughly 10 kilograms—or 22 pounds—of lithium in it https://www2.calrecycle.ca.gov/Publications/Download/1391?opt= https://www2.calrecycle.ca.gov/Publications/Download/1391?op... > The average battery contains between 16 to 21 pounds of lead FWIW this might be particularly useful: https://www.quora.com/Does-Teslas-70-kWh-battery-have-63-kg-of-lithium-and-if-so-why/answer/Chad-Courtney-1 https://www.quora.com/Does-Teslas-70-kWh-battery-have-63-kg-... > The original 70kWh Model S battery had 63kg of Lithium Carbonate Li2CO3. Often this was stated as the amount of lithium, which isn’t correct. Especially when people tried to compare it to the amount of known lithium available. While it’s typically sold as Lithium Carbonate, that’s not equivalent to the amount of Lithium available. > There’s about 12kg of Lithium in 63kg of Lithium Carbonate, so that original 70kWh Model S battery had 12kg of Lithium. I don’t know how much it has today, but they’ve been improving the chemistry to use less materials like Cobalt and Lithium.

> I don’t hear anyone saying we’re running out of lead. Don't know much about materials science but is demand for lead expected to equal demand for lithium?

by jjcon 4y ago

> I don’t hear anyone saying we’re running out of lead. Don't know much about materials science but is demand for lead expected to equal demand for lithium?

saurik 4y ago

There is about the same weight of lead in a normal car with a lead acid battery as there is lithium in an EV, but I don't know how we are measuring the total available amount of both for that abundance as the weight of an atom of lead is like 30-35 times that of lithium.

lelanthran 4y ago
> There is about the same weight of lead in a normal car with a lead acid battery as there is lithium in an EV, but I don't know how we are measuring the total available amount of both for that abundance as the weight of an atom of lead is like 30-35 times that of lithium. This I never knew! Is there really only 3Kgs of lithium in a Tesla battery pack?
- int_19h 4y ago
  Your typical car lead-acid battery has 8-10 kg of lead.
  - lelanthran 4y ago
    > Your typical car lead-acid battery has 8-10 kg of lead. I didn't think so - the full lead-acid battery itself weighs less than 10kg, and it appeared to me that about half of that weight was the solution (water). Even if true, though, still very surprised that a ~550kg EV battery has less than 10kg of lithium.
    - saurik 4y ago
      https://www.barrons.com/amp/articles/new-risk-tesla-other-electric-vehicle-makers-lithium-supply-batteries-51601498472 https://www.barrons.com/amp/articles/new-risk-tesla-other-el... > a single EV has roughly 10 kilograms—or 22 pounds—of lithium in it https://www2.calrecycle.ca.gov/Publications/Download/1391?opt= https://www2.calrecycle.ca.gov/Publications/Download/1391?op... > The average battery contains between 16 to 21 pounds of lead FWIW this might be particularly useful: https://www.quora.com/Does-Teslas-70-kWh-battery-have-63-kg-of-lithium-and-if-so-why/answer/Chad-Courtney-1 https://www.quora.com/Does-Teslas-70-kWh-battery-have-63-kg-... > The original 70kWh Model S battery had 63kg of Lithium Carbonate Li2CO3. Often this was stated as the amount of lithium, which isn’t correct. Especially when people tried to compare it to the amount of known lithium available. While it’s typically sold as Lithium Carbonate, that’s not equivalent to the amount of Lithium available. > There’s about 12kg of Lithium in 63kg of Lithium Carbonate, so that original 70kWh Model S battery had 12kg of Lithium. I don’t know how much it has today, but they’ve been improving the chemistry to use less materials like Cobalt and Lithium.