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> Like me, the majority of the campus was not here at the beginning of this matter in 2016. This is a dynamic not enough people appreciate: universities are no

> Like me, the majority of the campus was not here at the beginning of this matter in 2016. This is a dynamic not enough people appreciate: universities are not generally permanent communities. This fact is lost again and again in public debate. For example, there’s debate about how allegations of rape should be handled by a university. However the university handles possible rapes, they have to take into account the fact that everyone involved: victim, accuser, and witnesses, might drop out or graduate a week into the investigation.

devwastaken 4y ago
Uni lead "investigations" would be illigal under any other context. You are not allowed any rights in their "investigation". No representation. Their is no standard or rules of submitting evidence. The panel is not comprised of qualified jurors, nor are they generally of peers. They're positions applied for, so only those whom want to remove men from universities apply today. Now they're installing far more cameras, telling students to report on one another about everything, and giving campus mall cops free reign to harass students into giving false information and unreasonable search and seizures. Wish I was making that up, but that's what happens when we value "safety" more than rights.
- pyuser583 4y ago
  What your describing is a standard HR investigation.
timellis-smith 4y ago
True, but cultures persist unless there is an active effort to change it. Acknowledging the institution was wrong would be the first step to changing the culture.
- pyuser583 4y ago
  Acknowledgement from whom? Will the acknowledgment be meaningful to the next class of student? Acknowledging wrongs is most meaningful when all the stakeholders participate. When you are constantly getting new stakeholders, and losing old ones, it’s hard to meaningful buy in.
Turing_Machine 4y ago
> For example, there’s debate about how allegations of rape should be handled by a university. They shouldn't be handling those allegations in the first place. That's not their role. We have institutions like police departments and court systems specifically intended to handle such allegations. Now one can certainly argue that the police and courts have many problems (and, I agree: they absolutely do), but those problems are unlikely to be handled any better by amateurs (such as the typical university administrator).

devwastaken 4y ago

Uni lead "investigations" would be illigal under any other context. You are not allowed any rights in their "investigation". No representation. Their is no standard or rules of submitting evidence. The panel is not comprised of qualified jurors, nor are they generally of peers. They're positions applied for, so only those whom want to remove men from universities apply today. Now they're installing far more cameras, telling students to report on one another about everything, and giving campus mall cops free reign to harass students into giving false information and unreasonable search and seizures. Wish I was making that up, but that's what happens when we value "safety" more than rights.

pyuser583 4y ago
What your describing is a standard HR investigation.

timellis-smith 4y ago

True, but cultures persist unless there is an active effort to change it. Acknowledging the institution was wrong would be the first step to changing the culture.

pyuser583 4y ago
Acknowledgement from whom? Will the acknowledgment be meaningful to the next class of student? Acknowledging wrongs is most meaningful when all the stakeholders participate. When you are constantly getting new stakeholders, and losing old ones, it’s hard to meaningful buy in.

Turing_Machine 4y ago

> For example, there’s debate about how allegations of rape should be handled by a university. They shouldn't be handling those allegations in the first place. That's not their role. We have institutions like police departments and court systems specifically intended to handle such allegations. Now one can certainly argue that the police and courts have many problems (and, I agree: they absolutely do), but those problems are unlikely to be handled any better by amateurs (such as the typical university administrator).